Wanna bettaworld

What's wrong with feminism?

I recall that our mod was going to post on this topic -
but let me give you my take on it.

1) "It is not our job to educate you".

of course it is - if you are serious about social change, you have to talk about it and argue against the detractors.
Greenpeace, the Fair Trade Movement, Pro Israel or Pro Palestinians - they will all tell you all you want to know about their position and why you should join them. Only feminists operate inside the "if you don't already know AND ACCEPT WHAT WE SAY, then you ought to" bubble. Ok, other advocates for other causes are getting on the bandwagon , but I recall the Feminists getting in first - and it is dead wrong.

You believe something? then it is *your* job to convince *me* - don't expect me to say "gee, you must be right , let me go look up some supporting evidence.

2) Raising woman up does not have to entail tearing men down.
A lot of feminists say thay have not got Pat Boxall's attitude. No sir.
Me, I will believe it when I see it happen. to be honest, a lot of feminists *are* Okay about men - actually like and encourage male company. they will even say that society is unfair to men in some ways. And this , I notice, will spark several other feminists off into saying that women like that "are not real feminists".

3) Social change is not a 'women's issue'.
It belongs to everyone. What is with calling it 'womens studies'?
Isn't 'gender studies' more appropriate? if you think that most (or even some ) women do not get paid as much as men - and that this is unfair, then do you have to be female to point this out? Too find out and say so? Of course not!
And yet this empahasis on it being about women and only women is something that isn't helping women get anywhere.

It is, to be frank, beginning to look as if feminism is simply a glorified ' sulk session' by certain academics. Ok, maybe more men than women get into the top positions in society. but, as someone who isn't a CEO myself, what the hell has it got to do with me?

the real cutting edge movements that are making change are those that welcome both sexes and preach a message. The Trade Unions, the ecologists and reformers of every stripe are not interested in what is ' wrong' with you. Send a donation and a sign up form and you are in.

And yet some feminists wants to draw lines around who is and isn't 'a real feminist'.

Well, that will do for starters. Any other contributions, comments for or against, or feedback ' just to say hi' is more than welcome.
eagle icon

Newbie post.

Hi.
My name's Gerry. On line, I'm known as Minto Grubb, and I'm 52, married, and resident in the UK.
that's me in the picture with the eagle.

For a lot of blokes of my era, femininsm, gender politics and all that was a bit of a shake up.
the old rules were out, but there were no new ones in yet when it came to dealing with women in any sort of context.

My dad was a hard drinking, macho, northern coal miner. But his world was crumbling around him and he refused to see it. Being a man in his time meant having a macho job, doing a lot of drinking and getting away with as much as possible for as little in return. The pit closures, the rise of Equality Laws and much else besides put the lid on all that.

So, if I was going to be a man in this brave new world, what did that entail, exactly?
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The Pleiades

An Apology

My sincerest apologies if I wrote anything that may have offended someone recently. I was intoxicated for days after having a nervous breakdown over my job.

I'm really sorry if anyone got their feelings hurt.
The Pleiades

Confused By Women

I have gotten real confused over my niece and I don't think I have handled some it well.

I never suspected any woman would want to be protected.

What I have thought I knew about women must be wrong.

Many women seem to thrive, get off on and like being victims. I figure there must be alot of masochistic women but certainly as many masochistic men.

I should have told my niece in the past that I would protect her because that is what she wanted to hear from me. She wanted to hear that she is weaker than men, when in all actuality smaller is no disadvantage of all and women are no weaker than men.

Her lesbian victim, weaker stance confused me considering she is a violent dangerous personality.

It's kind of like how people mispercieve men as being dangerous so many times. I have never been affraid of a man in my life. I have always seen them as much more immature and weaker spiritually than all the years that I have had to fight against women for my real self.
vacation, contemplation

What are the Valid Issues of Feminism?

I am sure that there are individuals who could populate a list with two hundred items, but I am not aware of many which I consider valid. If I leave something out that you think important, then please comment.

1. Victim fault psychology.
Those that perpetrate rape bear the guilt of the crime, but this is often not the mentality of jurors and, many times, the victims themselves. Individuals and groups in this society, as well as others, are mistaught concerning what a woman's dress or affections imply or "allow," therefore scantily clad women are thought to blame for sexual harrassments or assaults that they may suffer. Dress realistically implies nothing and physical contact with someone is only allowable if permitted by that person. In addition to subjecting the victim to another crime, victim fault psychology prevalent in our judicial and social systems eliminate the responsibility that comes with moral agency. Rather than being treated as a man/woman(yes, women sometimes rape women), the criminal becomes, to their advantage, an animal forced by the hand of lust, exacerbated by the victim's immodesty. In this way is the criminal made irresponsible, as if criminally insane. People are responsible for each of their actions, despite whatever supposed influences are present. This should not be denied. Ever.

2. Equal pay and career double standardism.
This takes no thought whatever. Two jobs of the same responsibility done to the same standard by individuals of the same education level should be rewarded equally. Nothing about the individuals doing the work matters. Period. Women who pursue a career instead of a family are sometimes looked down upon and communications between men and women versus men and men or women and woman are sometimes skewed in women's disfavor because of differences in the social structure of how women and men usually communicate. For example, a woman leaning in and touching when talking to a woman is ok, but her actions may be judged as "flirting" if she communicates with a male in the same way despite the probable lack of romantic intent. Personal note: I think corporations should hire social psychologists and sociologists to form a "professional code of conduct" which balances both systems of communication so that misunderstandings will be lessened.

3. Objectification of women in media.
Women are equal to men in their ability to think, in their free moral agency, in their humanity. Women are not objects of desire or paragons of passion or anything else so extreme and inflexible. They are females, designed to complement males perfectly. Women are perfectly human and should not be thought less so. No, I am not asserting that men are impervious to objectification, but, as I understand, that is not a concern of feminism. My view, for the record, is that neither sex should be objectified.

4. Murder of female infants and genital mutilation.
Many female children in China and other countries are murdered simply because there is a prevalent view in those countries that males are superior. There should be no question here as to why this is a concern. Genital mutilation is still imposed upon young girls of a few peoples in Africa before they can even object. If you don't know what female circumcision is, I suggest that you google it. It bears little resemblance to the custom of circumcising male children which is oft practiced in the US. No person should be deprived choice concerning something so life-affective as this. The women in these groups are not allowed to choose.

5. Sexism.
Neither sex is better than the other. They are different, but they are equally valuable. However, sexism is a common system of poisoned thought in this country, along with racism, and classism.

That is all I have as issues I see as valid in feminism. My next post will concern what I view as ridiculous/horrendous/unrealistic/illogical in the feminist agenda, deo volente.

Be well and peaceful.

Jones
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clown

On being a Man

Firstly, I love women. I am one of the most chivalrous men you will ever meet. What disappoints me is a lot of the bullshit with gender roles.

For women: if she sleeps around, she's a slut. if a guy sleeps around, he's a stud or player.

For men: why can't we be househusbands and sit around watching soap operas all day?

There is a lot of hypocrisy on both sides. It has to do with our society that we are all a part of.