Rufus Honker IV ([info]rufushonkeriv) wrote in [info]worldofwarcraft,
@ 2008-05-10 20:46:00
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I understand this info could be used for evil as well as for good, but...
How, exactly, does kill-stealing work?

It pops up a lot on the Isle of Qael'Danas. I tag something and someone else snags the tag off me. Whenever I try to tag (out of curiosities sake), something someone else has tagged, all I ever end up doing is help them kill it faster. 

What's the mechanic or the trick that I'm missing here?

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[info]usekh
2008-05-11 12:53 am UTC (link)
Pretty simple really, say I am moving to melee something are you are well behind me and tag it with a ranged instant of something before I can get to it.

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[info]mephron
2008-05-12 07:17 pm UTC (link)
Which pisses my ret paladin self off badly, because we don't have a lot of long-range stuff to use. Admittedly, I did have a lot of fun over at the Seat when someone did this to me with the fel sparks and didn't watch as two Wraths walked towards him at once.

And then he sends me a tell of 'rez now'. No 'please'. Not even a 'plz'. Just 'now'. "Walk it off!" I say, and go back to killing.

So he started following me around.

So I ran over and aggroed Kazzak. Which is dumb, I know, but hey, multisquash is fun for dealing with someone blindly following you.

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[info]usekh
2008-05-12 07:47 pm UTC (link)
It it always drives me nuts. And eesh kill steals then demands a rez?

Heh I had one person who was flagged do it to me. It was cheesy but I took some satisfaction in blue flagging him :P

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[info]iwanttobeasleep
2008-05-11 12:53 am UTC (link)
Kill stealing doesn't work in WoW anymore, since we tag things. It's probably glitching, or you didn't actually tag it. If you're putting a dot on something, for example, if it doesn't tick before someone else attacks, you won't get the tag.

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[info]rufushonkeriv
2008-05-11 12:58 am UTC (link)
That sounds probable. It mostly happens on my Warlock.

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[info]ashenmonuments
2008-05-11 01:03 am UTC (link)
sadly, engaging a mob in combat is not equivalent to tagging. and I'm not entirely certain the first tick of damage counts either. I've landed Incinerates before, seen the damage go down, mob turns and heads towards me, then someone else engages and the bar goes grey. However, this could be explained as server/client lag.

I just try to pull with something that front loads damage, such as Incinerate, Searing Pain or Shadow Burn if I've plenty of shards. That normally tends to work. If not, I wait for the jerk to finish or move elsewhere.

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[info]kovacs
2008-05-11 01:31 am UTC (link)
I've landed Incinerates before, seen the damage go down, mob turns and heads towards me, then someone else engages and the bar goes grey.

That happens to me when I'm lagging... Or did, before I got Fire Blast. I use it a lot when someone is being a dick inconsiderate, and it annoys the stereotypical "Huntard" to no end. I can beat them about 95% of the time now.

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[info]pleroma
2008-05-11 01:58 am UTC (link)
I've seen this too without the lag part. I've started attacking and someone grabs it from me after I know I've at least landed something on it. They just landed something way bigger on it damage-wise.

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[info]esran
2008-05-11 08:43 am UTC (link)
Yeah. I think if someone grabs agro off you in that very short time before the mob decides who has tagged it ...

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[info]juel
2008-05-11 02:29 pm UTC (link)
I've had 2-3 combo points on something and lost the tag somehow. =X That is freakin irritating.

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[info]ashenmonuments
2008-05-11 03:22 pm UTC (link)
that ... is odd.
i'd guess a severe case of lag, or the health mod not updating. that does suck tho.

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[info]redarius
2008-05-11 07:13 am UTC (link)
Searing Pain is your friend for tagging mobs.

Using a wand works too, or anything that actually hurts. Also, there can be a latency factor. Just because your client doesn't show it doesn't mean someone didn't tag it 300ms before you did. It's definitely more frustrating on a 'lock if you're pulling with DoTs.

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[info]tokudama
2008-05-11 01:00 pm UTC (link)
This is why I love my felguard. if intercept is up, I can usually get the mob tagged first :)

I pull with immolate mostly, but will use shadowburn if there's a lot of competition.

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[info]zerorevenge
2008-05-11 10:55 pm UTC (link)
Your Icon is pure win.

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[info]knowledgequeen
2008-05-11 01:06 am UTC (link)
If you "tag" with a DoT, you will have your mob "stolen" before the first tick a lot of times. It happens a lot on my shadow priest, which is why I pull with Mind Flay. Instant damage. Start off with a shadowbolt and then the mob is irretrievably yours.

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[info]masteradept
2008-05-11 01:28 am UTC (link)
same..or SW:D...

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[info]stanleytweedle
2008-05-11 01:23 am UTC (link)
Sort of on-topic, an underhand trick I've seen happen lately is with the guys up in the Throne of Kil'Jaeden that you use the siphon on... I have seen people that hang around and wait until someone has siphoned off the eliteness and then jump in and steals the weakened guy...

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[info]masteradept
2008-05-11 01:29 am UTC (link)
its a new mob i think...so yea thats Ks forsure.

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[info]particle_man
2008-05-11 01:36 am UTC (link)
I always tag the elite first and then siphon them. Since the siphon also slows it can still be timed correctly to keep them from getting to you as an elite and hitting you too hard. I don't stop the damage once the mob is stunned either, I keep loading them up with damage. So far I have yet to have anyone successfully steal one from me since the first time it happened.

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[info]ashenmonuments
2008-05-11 02:12 am UTC (link)
Yarr. If you use something thats not an instant to tag them, by the time the mob gets hit, the cooldown will be up on the item so you can smack 'em with the wussifyer.

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[info]tokudama
2008-05-11 01:01 pm UTC (link)
yup. Learned that one the hard way.

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[info]ookaholic
2008-05-11 05:11 am UTC (link)
frostbolt has become my new best friend up there. I do that then syphon and voila no stolen mob

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[info]honem
2008-05-12 02:49 pm UTC (link)
As a Mage I sheep them then use the nullifier ;D

I find most people will totally ignore a sheep

By the time I've had a weee cup of tea the mobs non elitified . Haven't tested if this actually tags them or not

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[info]unmei_no_laluna
2008-05-12 08:47 pm UTC (link)
it doesnt' I've had sheeped mobs killed before I could cast my spell

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[info]justin4140
2008-05-11 03:01 am UTC (link)
this happens to me sometimes. someone will just be engaging a mob and have say 95% of it's health left, if i crit it with say a fireblast i'll get the tag even though they had hit it first.

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[info]evilfoo
2008-05-11 03:09 am UTC (link)
You're pretty fortunate to get to 70 and not have ppl kill steal you before this! This sort of thing went on during the Yeti quest from Father Winter, for example.

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[info]grumblybear
2008-05-11 03:18 am UTC (link)
Right before someone is about to tag a mob, you bust down their front door and punch them in the face.

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[info]what9000
2008-05-11 05:13 am UTC (link)
If the mob name goes gray, it's not yours.

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[info]puppy_tenchan
2008-05-11 07:00 am UTC (link)
Contrary to what some people believe, merely poking a mob does not suffice to tag it. I have tried it purposefully both with DotS and low white damage (like a dagger poke on a higher level mob) and another player who would wait until after the first damage tick before engaging, and there is apparently a certain threshold of damage (or threat, I am not sure about that) that has to be done after engaging to claim the mob irreversibly. It's tiny, but it is there.

Your best bet is to open fights in an area where you suspect kill stealing might happen with something that does a little bit more damage right away than your normal preferred opener. (As a Warlock, I found Life Tap to work fine, and always send your pet out a little earlier than casting your first spell.)

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[info]cultureofdoubt
2008-05-11 08:14 am UTC (link)
Life tap? How does that work to tag a mob?

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[info]puppy_tenchan
2008-05-11 08:24 am UTC (link)
This is what happens when I comment before my coffee!

I mean Siphon Life of course.

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[info]cultureofdoubt
2008-05-11 08:32 am UTC (link)
Ah no problem. Been doing that myself a lot lately!

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[info]cratermoon
2008-05-11 05:16 pm UTC (link)
Soloing as a disc/holy priest though, I'm a bit short on ranged instants. Holy Nova is instant and has a short range, not very mana-efficient, but for the dailies around the demon portal in QT it works pretty good, if a bit dangerously. It occurs to me, though, maybe I should get my Linkin's Boomerang out of the bank.

What annoys me more than not being able to tag a mob before someone else gets it is when the other player tags it first and then my spell hits and pulls aggro, and the other player lets it go beat on me. This usually happens when my mana isn't topped off and/or have blown my o shit cooldowns already. I know, I could have stopped and had a drink and been at full mana, but you know how it is when you need just ONE more drop to finish a quest and the drop rate is lame.

So yeah, I can forgive you tagging my mob first where there's competition and lots of people running around, but by the Light, if it's your mob, YOU do the fighting.

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[info]neuroxin
2008-05-12 01:47 am UTC (link)
Being a priest, I usually use SWD when people are starting to become KS nazis.

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[info]cyanrose
2008-05-11 10:37 pm UTC (link)
A bit of a fun issue I had regarding this...

I was AoE Grinding in Dalson's Tears, about 12 mobs on me when a mage comes up, my faction and tries to AoE anything I haven't tagged since I JUST did the pull. Well, he's close enough... and to his suprise I bubbled at 95%, and since my aggro was wiped... and he wasn't frost... INCOMING army of mobs! He did that twice, died twice to them, and I got a nice, flavorful whisper after. Ha ha, bubbles~

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[info]neuroxin
2008-05-12 01:54 am UTC (link)
The tag is definitely given to whomever damages the mob first. I have seen instances where it seemed as if I was the first one to damage the mob and yet someone else got the tag, but it's obvious that that could be explained away by client or server lag. You will consistently see that the tag is given to whomever gets the first tick of damage. There are lots of reasons that could cause people to see things that might make them think that it has something to do with threat or the amount of damage either player has done. It has nothing to do with either thing. It's definitely whomever gets does the first tick of damage.

I open with dots on my shadow priest a lot and sometimes if I'm not watching the other players around me someone will steal the kill. It happens a LOT on Quel'Danas. When things start to get hairy I start opening with Shadow Word: Death or Mind Flay. If I was a Warlock I would probably open with Drain Health or Shadowburn or Searing Pain.

The only thing that makes me feel not so bad when someone steals my kill is that I open with Vampiric Touch, Vampiric Embrace, Shadow Word: Pain. So it might be their mob, but i'm still getting mana and health regenned off of the damage my dots are doing.

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