Desperately Random ([info]crossoverman) wrote in [info]tommywestphall,
@ 2007-08-04 16:29:00
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Entry tags:possible update

Hang on to your snowglobes...
Okay.

I'm finally sifting through old emails, LJ notifications and [info]tommywestphall to make sense of all the suggestions and queries since our last major update... six months ago!

Here we go...

Thanks to Thom Holbrook's site - details to a fully-fledged crossover between CSI: New York and Cold Case

Morley Cigarettes grabs four more series:

  • Nash Bridges
  • Prison Break
  • Space Above and Beyond
  • That 70s Show

The fictional Los Angeles Tribune brings in (via Lou Grant, which is already on the grid):

  • Columbo
  • Moonlighting
  • 24
  • Matt Huston
  • Wonder Woman
  • Remington Steele
  • City of Angels
  • Burke's Law (1994)

Columbo then brings in Mrs Columbo (and the various series she morphed into)

Moonlighting crossed over with Hart to Hart

Burke's Law (1994) brings in its predecessors Burke's Law and Amos Burke - Secret Agent


The fictional Hudson University (originating with Law & Order) brings in:

  • Tru Calling
  • Without a Trace
(To answer a recent question, Hudson University also connects to the DC Universe series devised by Bruce Timm, as well as the DC comic universe itself)


The fictional Trans-Global Airlines (which actually originated in the Airport film series but got a mention on Matlock) brings in:

  • Young and the Restless
  • All My Children
  • Emergency

and possibly Quincy ME

Thanks to [info]tele_toby and his research, we find...

The Young and the Restless brings in The Bold and the Beautiful and As the World Turns

All My Children brings in General Hospital, One Life to Live, Port Charles and Loving

Emergency brings in Sierra and Adam 12

Adam 12 brings in Dragnet and Dragnet 67 (anyone know if Dragnet 67 is connected to the two revivals in the 80s and 90s?)


Also...

The Double Meat Corporation links Buffy the Vampire Slayer to the short-lived Andy Barker P.I.

The planet Gallifrey links Doctor Who with The Mighty Morphin Power Rangers which brings in the live action series Ninja Turtles the Next Mutation


And, finally, things that don't count...

Bernie Kopell did not appear as his Love Boat character on Fresh Prince of Bel Air, even though his character name was Doc

Columbo is not connected to Magnum P.I.

And the fictional magazine The National Inquisitor is currently being left out of the Westphall-verse to allow for more research on the subject.


That's an additional 35 series. The Grid and Key have not been updated yet. Let's discuss this compiled list and see if they have unearthed any further connections to expand the Tommy Westphall Universe.

(Post a new comment)

Speaking of soaps...
[info]buffyannotater
2007-08-04 07:51 am UTC (link)
Do you have the Passions/Las Vegas crossover on the list?

(Reply to this) (Thread)
Re: Speaking of soaps...
[info]crossoverman
2007-08-04 12:28 pm UTC (link)
Yes :-)

We really need an online list and not just a file to download...

(Reply to this) (Parent)
Literary Spin-off
[info]johnmunch
2007-08-04 10:20 am UTC (link)
Burke's Law also brings in Honey West, supposedly based on a series of private eye novels.

Re Dragnet: The '90s verion is connected in that it is supposed to be the same Joe Friday - which is somewhat ridiculous. In a similar vein, Adam West's Batman bears no resemblance to the Keaton or Bale version so I would not include them (yeah, yeah, they're movies, I know. So sue me).

TGA and/or the LA Tribune do not stir me that much. For that matter: Were the airline or the newspaper included as references to previous appearances, or were they simply re-invented every time? Meaning: The mental leap from TWA to TGA is a very small one, for example, so it is possible that TGA was re-invented again and again, apart from the obvious cases when the airline was used in shows which were already connected by solid - that is: character - crossovers.

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Re: Literary Spin-off
[info]crossoverman
2007-08-04 12:33 pm UTC (link)
We've already admitted Oceanic Airlines, so unless I was to go back and remove that, Trans Global and the LA Tribune stay. Almost certainly the LA Tribune is a reference to Lou Grant since that was the setting for the series.

Trans Global has as much right as Oceanic to claim Tommy's mental real-estate.

Thanks for the Honey West connection!

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]crossoverman
2007-08-04 01:19 pm UTC (link)
There's also a show called Masked Rider that was spun-off from Power Rangers

(Reply to this)


(Anonymous)
2007-08-04 01:26 pm UTC (link)
"Adam 12 brings in Dragnet and Dragnet 67 (anyone know if Dragnet 67 is connected to the two revivals in the 80s and 90s?)"
I actually don't think they were related. There was also a late 1980s revival of Adam 12, but I think those were reboots and not sequels.

If you're looking for upping the count, Wonder Woman was virtually two series, with a revamp from season one to two (changing from the 1940s setting to modern day).

And speaking of superhero shows, "(To answer a recent question, Hudson University also connects to the DC Universe series devised by Bruce Timm, as well as the DC comic universe itself)"--how ironic: I was the one who sent in the Hudson University info, only to forget that it gave a link to animation. By the way, I teach, so I won't get anything done for awhile (we are starting a new year), but I will start working on an animated, Muppet, and beyond collection of links.

Aren't the various Power Rangers shows all different series in a linked universe, or are they reboots?

Hugh

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]admiralmemo
2007-09-21 05:28 am UTC (link)
Power Rangers are all (or at least almost all) in a shared universe, basically due to the character of Tommy Oliver. I can confirm that everything from the original Mighty Morphin Power Rangers up to Power Rangers: Space Patrol Delta shares a universe. I assume, but can't confirm, that Mystic Force, Operation Overdrive, or Jungle Fury are also in the same setting.

Also, there is debate as to whether the episode "Forever Red" is canon. If so, it alone ties together everything from Mighty Morphin to Wild Force together.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]crossoverman
2007-08-04 01:34 pm UTC (link)
Wonder Woman was basically two different shows, but for this purpose they can remain one... it's an odd example!

Power Rangers are all linked. Basically the title changed with each season... but really, they are all "Power Rangers".

And even if it's not for a while, I'd love to see a Tommy Westphall spin-off of animated, Muppet connections... and if someone (else?) wanted to attempt it - movies!

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Expanding the Multi-Verse
(Anonymous)
2007-08-04 08:50 pm UTC (link)
I'll take that challenge. My own way of linking shows allows them to go through movies (so, for example, Alias Jesse James allows a cross for several TV westerns), and I definitely would use Muppets and animated means (I'm even fine with Father Guido and Pro-Wrestlers, to pick up comments others have made up here), so long as there is an intent to make a connection through fictional productions.

I love (because of its almost absurdity) that Doctor Who can bring in MMPR, just showing how varied this system can be. I have been thinking about the "Dimensions in Time" special that suggests a connection between DW & Eastenders. I know "DiT" isn't considered "canon" for DW, but, then again, neither are appearances by the TARDIS in Red Dwarf or Chelmsford 123 either. Plus, one DW novel hints that it is all a bad dream by the 7th Doctor, the perfect complement to Tommy's visions. There is a CD series called "Kaldor City" that connects characters from "Robots of Death" (a Tom Baker-era serial) with Blake's 7 (both are written by Chris Boucher). It's too bad JMS never pulled off the crossover he had wanted to with Babylon 5 and DW, or that would be a wonderful link.

Hugh (who promises, even if it takes a while, to dust off his notes and put a collection together)

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: Expanding the Multi-Verse
(Anonymous)
2007-09-14 08:37 am UTC (link)
The canonicity of "Dimensions in Time" for [i]Doctor Who[/i] is debatable, but the fact of the matter is that quite a few of the original [i]Doctor Who[/i] actors appear [i]in character[/i] for the special, as do quite a few [i]Eastenders[/i] characters. It's a lot more solid a link than quite a few actually. Would [i]Eastenders[/i] link to any other British series?

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The Wold Newton Family: Someone has less of a life than us
(Anonymous)
2007-08-22 05:50 am UTC (link)
Crossoverman, if you're serious about using movies (or other media) as links, you should see http://www.pjfarmer.com/woldnewton/Pulp2.htm
It's a page devoted to Philip Jose Farmer's Wold Newton family - the premise being that a meteor landing in 18th century England mutated all of the witnesses and their descendants, giving them enhanced strength and intelligence. Those who supposedly had the Wold Newton gene include Tarzan, Doc Savage, Sherlock Holmes, and James Bond.

The emphasis is more on fictional history and genealogy than on tracking crossovers, but that hasn't stopped Win Scott Eckert from compiling a Crossover Chronology of all the characters linked to the family, and a separate TV crossovers page (see site map at the link).
Just from memory:

-Magnum P.I. repeatedly crossed over with Simon and Simon, which crossed over with the short-lived Whiz Kids
-On Star Trek: The Next Generation, one of the shuttles on the Enterprise is called the Indiana Jones. While Indy is originally a movie character, this may bring in The Young Indiana Jones Chronicles.
-On a related note, why did you state that Columbo is not linked to Magnum? The TV crossovers page claims that Magnum, Columbo, Kojak and Mike Stone (from The Streets of San Francisco) all were in an episode of Magnum together, but I haven't seen the episode in question so I can't confirm this. I'm not criticizing, I just want to know what the rationale is.
-One of my own: In the pilot episode of Quantum Leap, Sam claims that one of his relatives married Thomas Magnum's cousin Jim Bonick, thus linking QL to Magnum P.I.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: The Wold Newton Family: Someone has less of a life than us
[info]crossoverman
2007-08-22 06:02 am UTC (link)
The Wold Newton Universe works on a completely different set of rules to the extent where even real world people will connect fictional works. This has been ruled out as a way to connect shows in the Tommy Westphall Universe because it takes a lot of the fun out of it.

I don't ever remember a Star Trek shuttle called the Indiana Jones, but that might be a nod to the fictional character.

There was supposedly a Columbo TV movie that contained all of those detective characters, but this never existed as far as I can tell. There's possibly in joke references to those types of characters or even characters that might look like them, but actual appearances by those characters or the actors never happened.

QL and Magnum creator Don Belissario always wanted to do a direct crossover of the two shows, but it never worked out. It doesn't surprise me there would be a small nod between both, but this is the first time I've read evidence that there was one. Where did you find this info?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: The Wold Newton Family: Someone has less of a life than us
(Anonymous)
2007-08-23 04:54 am UTC (link)
I apologize for not sourcing my material better in the original post. It was late and I was tired.

Much of the information comes from the Wold Newton site that I linked to. I was aware that Wold Newton essays usually use different rules to link works together, but that doesn't mean that it can't be a useful resource. To be fair, it's not the same as actually seeing the episode in question - the website lists that Columbo episode as existing. Also, the Win Eckart page no longer uses Historical figures as links, according to the philosophy page.

The reason you don't remember the Indiana Jones is because it's only visible listed on a status display in the ST:TNG episode 'Coming of Age'. It's never referred to in dialogue, but neither are the various Star Trek references to Yoyodyne propulsion systems, the wanted poster for an X-files villain in Veronica Mars, etc. The existence of the Indiana Jones shuttle is confirmed at Memory Alpha, the Star Trek wiki and also the Crossover Chronology.
http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Indiana_Jones
This reminds me of another connection:Benjamin Sisko has a baseball card for the fictional Buck Bokai, who pitched a couple of seasons for the Gotham City Bats - connecting DS9 to Batman.

That Simon and Simon crossed over with Magnum P.I. is noted at
http://www.pjfarmer.com/woldnewton/TV.htm
http://www.poobala.com/crossoverlist.html
and the wikipedia article for Simon and Simon.

That Quantum Leap's pilot episode referred to a character from Magnum comes from Wikipedia as well.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_Leap
The section on the Magnum PI connection. I have not seen the episode myself, but was hoping someone else had.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: The Wold Newton Family: Someone has less of a life than us
[info]crossoverman
2007-08-23 05:13 am UTC (link)
I tend to like two sources of information if I can't visually verify things myself. No mention of any of those actors appearing on Columbo is listed anywhere, so I doubt the connection holds up.

The name Yoyodyne can be seen a couple of times throughout the run of Next Generation - fleeting glances, but can certainly be seen. Again, the Indiana Jones name doesn't really tell us if it was referencing the "real" or fictional Indiana, so a shared universe isn't certain.

The wanted poster for an X-Files villain is very clearly seen in Veronica Mars - it's in no way similar to the very detailed status displays on Next Gen that were mostly unreadable.

Thanks for the Simon and Simon/Magnum crossover info!

And, yes, it looks like Quantum Leap and Magnum are also joined up.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]admiralmemo
2007-09-21 05:42 am UTC (link)
Don Belissario actually wanted to have Sam leap into Magnum in an episode.

(Reply to this) (Parent)
a few things
(Anonymous)
2007-08-04 04:11 pm UTC (link)
thanks for the update crossoverman

First I think the National Inquisitor should be in, because it's office was the setting of the tv show The Naked Truth, like the LA Tribune was in Lou Grant (I am not just saying this because I did most of the research for the inquisitor)

Also I remember reading either here or at Toobworld that there was some connection between Columbo and Murder, She Wrote, do you know what it was

TGA also appeared on Miami Vice

A connection was also found between Sports Night and the West Wing through the Shearson company

Finally a new possible connection, people from Mission Impossible, The Avengers, and I Spy appeared as retired spies on a show called Spy Games.

I hope this helps some with finding connections

RAF

(Reply to this) (Thread)
Re: a few things
[info]crossoverman
2007-08-05 12:14 am UTC (link)
Well, the National Inquisitor predates The Naked Truth and is most likely just another name for the National Inquirer. I'm still not saying no to it, just putting it aside for now.

Not sure about the Columbo/Murder She Wrote connection.

Thanks for the Miami Vice heads-up!

Will research Spy Games...

Any further info about the Shearson Company? I don't remember them in the West Wing...

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: a few things
(Anonymous)
2007-08-05 02:06 am UTC (link)
It appears that he got the information about Shearson from this sight http://b4a.healthyinterest.net/extras/sn.html

After digging through this sits archives I found the MSW Columbo connection was from a sign for Monolith Studios

Also are you going to include the Singapore shows

Finally while looking at toobworld I found another newspaper the L.A. Chronicle from a show called I Had Three Wives that also appeared in Murder She Wrote, The Rockford Files, The Outsider, and Beverly Hills 90210 http://toobworld.blogspot.com/2006/03/museum-piece-030906.html

RAF

(Reply to this) (Parent)
Re: a few things
(Anonymous)
2007-08-05 11:31 am UTC (link)
Spy Game was a great show and great fun, but I don't think it lets too many further shows in. There were cameos by actors from 1960s spy shows, including Patrick MacNee, Peter Lupus, and Robert Culp, but they had different names, so unless you take the idea they were using aliases at one point or the other, it's not quite a crossover.

However, there is a connection that does work--the headquarters for the spies on this show was the same as the HQ on Man From UNCLE. I don't have my notes available, but I'm pretty sure without reviewing episodes that the "cover" for their HQ was presented as the same shop. None of this goes with the Tommy-view of things, but if it could come in, that would also bring The Girl from UNCLE and Please Don't Eat the Daisies (http://www.poobala.com/daisiesanduncle.html).

Hugh

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: a few things
[info]crossoverman
2007-08-05 11:48 am UTC (link)
If it's exactly the same building with exactly the same shop front name, I'll take it... But I agree that the cameo appearances aren't the same characters.

(Reply to this) (Parent)
Re: a few things
[info]tele_toby
2007-08-06 04:46 am UTC (link)
DelFlorio's Tailor Shop showed up in the background as David Jansen as Richard Kimble walked by it. Trouble is, the episode this happened in was set in Seattle. (I'll have to get back to the library of Toobworld Central to check it out once vacation is over.)

I had a Toobworld "splainin" for that however. Most major US cities had a DelFlorio's so that the UNCLE spies knew where to go to check in.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: a few things
[info]crossoverman
2007-08-06 05:30 am UTC (link)
That's fine by me - fictional Tailor shop in multiple cities works okay :-)

So it's in UNCLE, The Fugitive and Spy Game?

(Reply to this) (Parent)
Re: a few things
[info]tele_toby
2007-08-06 04:50 am UTC (link)
I'll need to check my Murder, She Wrote book once I get home, but the connection between Columbo and MSW is the Monolith (could be Mammoth) movie studio. It was used in several MSW episodes (I believe the one about the 'Friends'-like show "Buds" was one.) That same studio was where the "Murder With Too Many Notes" was committed. That was the one with Billy Connolly as the murderer, directed by Patrick McGoohan.)

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]jeb1981
2007-08-04 04:58 pm UTC (link)
Gallifrey was mentioned on Power Rangers? When?

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[info]crossoverman
2007-08-05 12:17 am UTC (link)
Actually, Gallifrey itself is not mentioned, but its co-ordinates and the constellation of Kasterborous are. The quote is lifted directly from on Old School Who episode.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]tele_toby
2007-08-06 04:41 am UTC (link)
Aired pilots for shows that never came to fruition count, right? Because if so, you should add 'Lookwell' to the list because of the L.A. Tribune. When I get back from vacation, I'll send you a nice screen grab of it with Adam West as Lookwell.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]crossoverman
2007-08-06 05:27 am UTC (link)
Aired pilots count. Looking forward to Lookwell :-)

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(Anonymous)
2007-08-06 06:04 pm UTC (link)
Speaking of Adam West, what about the pilot/two episode series Legends of the Superheroes where he appeared as Batman

RAF

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]crossoverman
2007-08-06 09:15 pm UTC (link)
I was under the impression that was a TV Movie/Mini-Series, never intended to be an ongoing series.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]johnmunch
2007-08-07 09:06 pm UTC (link)
Legends is in and has been on the Grid quite a while. Mini-series do count. So do pilots.

I need a good Electric Company guide.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]crossoverman
2007-08-07 09:18 pm UTC (link)
Legends doesn't count as a separate series for the Tommyverse as all spin-off TV movies and mini-series merely count as part of the original series. If Legends was the pilot for another series, that would be different.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Some additions
[info]johnmunch
2007-08-16 05:43 pm UTC (link)
Keith, at times I wish you would stop changing the rules. Mini series were declared 'in' by yourself, on the same level as pilots for failed shows (W*A*L*T*E*R et al.).

Legends was not a spin-off (ten years after Batman got cancelled???).

To pleasant things:

Remington Steele has a x-over with Moonlighting.

Moonlighting brings in Hart to Hart.

(Yes, the original moniker is working again. I have no idea why.)

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: Some additions
[info]crossoverman
2007-08-16 09:22 pm UTC (link)
Failed (non-back door) pilots register as a different show. Where have we listed a mini-series as a separate show?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Another lance for Legends
[info]johnmunch
2007-08-17 06:26 am UTC (link)
Hmm. You're right - sort of.

Way back, we had discussed Legends of the Super-Heroes with Batman (Adam West) providing the link to his original show. Then came a discussion if mini-series should qualify. Since there were shows with just one or two episodes aired (Public Morals comes to mind) mini series got ruled in. Only the Legends listing never appeared on the stats list, the Grid or the Key - something I have noticed just now.

I still say rule them in. It would be slightly ridiculous to leave something like, for example, Band of Brothers or Centennial out just because they did a pre-declared and limited number of episodes.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: Centennial
[info]tele_toby
2007-08-18 12:16 pm UTC (link)
With 26 hours, 'Centennial' would rank as a series in today's market! It had more hours than a lot of shows listed as series. Man, I'd love to see that come out on dvd! What a great series! And I wish there was a way to nab it for your Westphallian version of the TV Universe....

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(Anonymous)
2007-08-29 02:48 pm UTC (link)
Power Rangers brings in the Japanese series it was adapted from, Super Sentai http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_sentai

http://www.tv.com/power-rangers/bully-for-ethan/episode/332621/summary.html?tag=ep_list;ep_title;17

(Reply to this)

Another Jack Webb show
[info]johnmunch
2007-09-03 09:39 am UTC (link)
Adam-12 had a short-lived spin-off, The D.A., starring Robert Conrad as Deputy DA Paul Ryan. Apparently, that one started as a full-fledged pilot movie with the 15-episode show trailing behind in the 1971-1972 season with a x-over in the GAyda episode. To complicate matters even more, Paul Ryan was portrayed earlier by a different actor in Adam-12. Info taken from CTVA - tv.com barely managed an episode list.

(Reply to this)


(Anonymous)
2008-03-08 11:59 pm UTC (link)
I'm not sure whether this works, but Rev. Al Sharpton guest starred as himself in Boston Legal, a number of shows that are already on the list, but also makes a guest star as himself in My Wife and Kids, something I couldn't find on the list. It also makes the possibility that IRL is fictional too.

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[info]crossoverman
2008-03-09 12:28 am UTC (link)
Cameos by real people do not create fictional links.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Al Sharpton
(Anonymous)
2008-03-13 01:37 am UTC (link)
But is Al Sharpton real?

(Reply to this) (Parent)

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