petbulls: ok I wont be posting again after this po

Anissa (

jjgbabygirl) wrote in

petbulls,
@ 2005-11-18 17:33:00

ok I wont be posting again after this post because the response to my last post was crazy. I lost my dog & everyone is concerned with my vet told me or whatever. I cant help what my vet told me, I just posted exactly what he told me. believe me I thought people would be more supportive of someone losing a dog they loved but I guess I was wrong. goodbye.

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theravada
2005-11-18 02:58 pm UTC (link)

You can help what your vet told you. If you went to a doctor and they told you that you had a terminal disease, wouldn't you want to educate yourself about your condition before you just excepted what the doctor told you at face value?

You could have taken a day or two to read up on the condition, educate yourself about your options, and gone to a different clinic. When a situation is a matter of life or death, it seems reasonable that you could have taken some time to pause and consider what the vet was telling you instead of just killing your dog "because the vet said so".

If he was in pain, you could have gotten pain medication from your vet. You could have made him comfortable.

It really pisses me off that you take this high and mighty position about "oh no, I couldn't kill unborn puppies!" and won't spay your pregnant bitch, but you just EUTHANIZED a six month old puppy. Please, please, try to explain to me your logic behind THAT little distinction.

You are stubborn, ignorant, and you have no desire to educate yourself or do to right thing by spaying your dog.

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	bellasmommy 2005-11-18 03:03 pm UTC (link)
	Yet another reason why I love teh bruce. He speaks the truth. (Replies frozen)(Parent)

	metalkat 2005-11-18 03:07 pm UTC (link)
	She sat there with the dog that had NO fur, covered in oozing blood and puss... and now she's crying foul when people are upset about it?! Whatever. (Replies frozen)(Parent)(Thread)

	hildythenerd 2005-11-18 03:23 pm UTC (link)
	Yikes. I didn't realize he was oozing blood and puss. I must have missed that post? That just breaks my heart. (Replies frozen)(Parent)(Thread)

jjgbabygirl
2005-11-18 03:31 pm UTC (link)

yes he was oozing blood. here's the whole story because they dont have a clue. when i brought Titan in my home in september (i even posted this back then) he was a stray & had very bad skin problems that we didnt know was mange. He already had a lot of hair loss & sores from scratching & all that. we took him to 3 different vets. the 1st vet treated him for allergic reactions to food & we changed his diet, everything. took him to another vet because it was just getting worse & he said it was allergies too, probably envirnmental so we treated him again. still he got worse & i was taking him back & forth to vets offices crying for someone to help him & no one was fixing the problem. finally the last vet said it was mange & he was in so much pain & it couldnt be cured so he had to be put to sleep. I loved my dog, my dogs are just about all I have & I sat up night after night crying because I couldnt figure out why he wasnt getting better. I didnt "just let it get that bad." I wouldnt sit there & watch my best friend die if I knew what to do to fix it. but since I'm pregnant & easily upset I felt that leaving the community is needed because they obviously dont understand & I cant deal with those emotions on top of losing my Titan

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	cottonmanifesto 2005-11-19 06:44 am UTC (link)
	The thing is, I find it incredibly hard to believe that a vet wouldn't, at the very least, prescribe antibiotics to a dog that had open sores all over his body. I think the majority of the people that have been commenting are frustrated at the many holes in your story. (Replies frozen)(Parent)

	cottonmanifesto 2005-11-18 03:24 pm UTC (link)
	It's all horrifically sad, but I agree with you 110%. (Replies frozen)(Parent)

	mixmastermolly 2005-11-18 03:02 pm UTC (link)
	I'm sorry you feel that you were ganged up on. But instead of being angry take advantage of the fact that the educated people here have told you your vet isn't a good one to be visiting. Change vet for your current dogs and those puppies. (Replies frozen)(Thread)

jjgbabygirl
2005-11-18 03:06 pm UTC (link)

the problem is, I took Titan to 3 different vets. I wasnt going on just what 1 said. I did everything i could & spent a shit load of money trying to help him but the last vet said he couldnt even let him leave the office & he was in so much pain that I couldnt stand seeing him hurt anymore. Titan was so bad by the time I got him to the last vet that there was nothing he could do. i dont trust my 1st vet at all & I blame him for Titan's death because had he treated him correctly the first time Titan would still be here.

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	mixmastermolly 2005-11-18 03:21 pm UTC (link)
	I understand it was difficult for you. I think what's hard for everyone to understand is that the information is so false, and mange doesn't just get that bad overnight. (Replies frozen)(Parent)(Thread)

jjgbabygirl
2005-11-18 03:26 pm UTC (link)

when i brought titan into my home he already had mange pretty bad. we didnt know it was mange. he was already having hair loss & sores from scratching but the vet said allergies so we treated him for several allergic reaction type issues & it just kept getting worse. he was bad when we got him. the post i posted back in september (when we brought him in) stated that he had bad skin issues. I carried him to vets crying begging them to fix him, do something & no one treated him for what it really was.

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onyourown
2005-11-18 03:13 pm UTC (link)

I'm sorry you feel the need to leave the community and I'm sorry you're letting a few people chase you out. But you have to understand that many of the people in this community know almost everything (and in a few cases everything) there is to know about dogs and their health. They're trying to inform you and tell you that bringing these pups into the world is dangerous for the pups and that your vet (or all of the vets you spoke with) lead you wrong. I really wish you wouldn't leave as I would love to hear how things turn out with you, but if you feel this is what you need to do, then I wish you luck with your pups and I'm sorry for you and Titan.

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jjgbabygirl
2005-11-18 03:18 pm UTC (link)

I'm leaving because I'm pregnant & get very upset very easily & there's no reason for me to sit in front of my computer & bawl like a baby over a lj community. yes I know some were trying to help but telling me that I let my dog die & blaming me for his death is not helpful. I tried so hard to save him, I took him to 3 vets & cried when he kept getting worse. I spent so much money on trying to treat him & nothing helped. if you want to you can always check out my personal journal because i can post freely there. Thank you for kind words because those are few & far between tonight. I liked that community but my emotions cant handle that stuff right now.

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slityourthroat
2005-11-18 03:27 pm UTC (link)

I didn't read your first post, and I don't know what happened, but I'm sorry for your loss. I know how painful it is to loose a loved pet. And I also know there's nothing I can really say to ease your pain, and nothing anyone can really say, to make you feel better, it's just going to take time. I hope you can atleast find comfort in knowing that your dog isn't in pain anymore.

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scarletk8
2005-11-18 04:35 pm UTC (link)

i ditto this.

there is always more than one side to any story. i didn't read the first post but regardless...obviously if you took him so many places, you gave it some effort. sounds like the vets were not on their game.

to those in the community who feel the need to be rude...
give the girl a break:
a. she's pregnant. that makes one whacko, as is.
b. the dog's condition was misdiagnosed. she's not a vet...why should she believe any different from what a vet tells her?
c. not everyone here is an expert on dogs. instead of berating her for not spaying a pregnant dog (i personally could never spay a pregnant dog. wanna call me ignorant?) why not recognize that this person has a heart to begin with (she did bring the mangy critter into her home after all) and educate her as needed so that she can make better use of her good intentions with the next dog she brings into her home.

newman has had some excessive redness as of late. i took him to the vet. they gave me a shitload of pills and a new shampoo. i bought the pills out of convenience along with the shampoo...seems shampoo was enough. the vet recommended allergy testing ($250+) i said maybe later. perhaps the shampoo may not have been enough...then maybe the pills wouldn't have been enough...then maybe i would have him tested and perhaps that wouldn't be enough...yes, i would keep trying as he has been my dog now for over three years. he's my souldogmate. if after taking him to numerous places and spending more money than i could possibly afford to take him to, there might eventually be a breaking point. that breaking point would break my heart more than anything. it's that part of me which sympathizes with this girl. a few of you lose my respect in the process.

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	jjgbabygirl 2005-11-18 04:41 pm UTC (link)
	thank you! would you mind if i add you as a friend? (Replies frozen)(Parent)

buboniclou
2005-11-18 05:48 pm UTC (link)

Here, here. Scarletk8 made a very good list/point.

This isn't why I joined the community, to see people reduced to fighting over ABORTION of all things, or to see people who have lost a loved one be second-guessed and attacked for poor handling on the part of medical professionals who do indeed often present an air of 'knowing all.' She not only got a 2nd but a 3rd opinion. There's only so much you can do with money and medicine when an animal is suffering, and it takes a great deal of compassion to put your dog to sleep. I would think all of us know this here, or will at some point. I know I do, and whatever her vet told her she had the responsibility to act on what she thought would be best for Titan, God rest his doggy soul.

I also don't see the logic in people saying "ok, you should abort puppy fetuses because dog lives are less precious than human", and then get all huffy about her putting one to sleep who was actually alive and suffering.

And for the record, I am pro-choice, not that it should matter in a community about pets.

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cottonmanifesto
2005-11-19 10:03 am UTC (link)

b. the dog's condition was misdiagnosed. she's not a vet...why should she believe any different from what a vet tells her?

Because the dogs condition was not improving (in fact, he got much much worse) and it seems logical to attempt something else? Because, at the very least, she could've posted here asking for advice before it became too late? If she had done so, someone would've undoubtedly suggested mange which could've been brought up to the vet and Titan would still be alive today.

c. not everyone here is an expert on dogs. instead of berating her for not spaying a pregnant dog (i personally could never spay a pregnant dog. wanna call me ignorant?) why not recognize that this person has a heart to begin with (she did bring the mangy critter into her home after all) and educate her as needed so that she can make better use of her good intentions with the next dog she brings into her home.

This girl had 4 intact dogs in her home. 3 of them were intact bitches. Imo, it is the height of irresponsibility to allow these dogs to interact as the heat cycle might not be obvious until it is too late. When she first posted about taking Titan into her home, I cautioned that this very thing might happen. She stated plans to neuter him and then neglected to. To now allow these pups to be born with an inherited genetic condition that predisposes them to mange is also highly irresponsible.

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scarletk8
2005-11-19 10:28 am UTC (link)

i don't argue with your points at all: she did make some poor decisions. unfortuantely, she learned the hard way. even if she did post in here first, who's to say a vet would give her proper treatment? the vet is the biggest idiot here seeing as he/she can't figure out a dog has mange.

i certainly don't condone all of the behavior of this girl and i agree there were some smarter decisions which could have been made. verbally battering her is not the way to prevent history from repeating itself. accepting that she did fuck up on everyone's part and acknowledgement on her part could bring everyone here to a place where we could advise her in the future and not simply criticize her. she will get more dogs, no doubt. so why chase her off? getting through to people rationally is the most proven method to problem solving. it is frustrating to see a 19 year-old girl make mistakes but it's more frustrating to me to see a bunch of well-educated adults reprimand her in this fashion.

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cottonmanifesto
2005-11-19 10:34 am UTC (link)

who's to say a vet would give her proper treatment?

Because if you've done research and you think your dog has a specific condition and you request that the vet test for it and s/he doesn't (and unlikely but not impossible scenario), you pack yourself up and go to another vet.

I agree, everyone makes mistakes but when you're specifically warned against something and you go ahead and do it anyway and refuse to deal responsibly with the results of your actions, then geez, you deserve to be yelled at.

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bullymama
2005-11-18 03:39 pm UTC (link)

I am so sorry about the loss of Titan. The loss of a pet is tremendously difficult. I'm also sorry that you feel the need to leave this community as I hate to see of our members leave. I don't believe that anyone was trying to be unsympathetic and it is often hard to express true feels ln a written online post. I think that we are all here, though, because we love both animals and humans. We mourn with you and people are trying to understand and educate so that they can mourn and help others that may end up in your same situation.

Please take care of yourself and your dog family.

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	littlehounddog 2005-11-18 04:44 pm UTC (link)
	Okay, despite my own opinions, this topic is now closed. (I wish I could freeze it- anyone know how?) (Replies frozen)(Thread)

	bullymama 2005-11-18 04:58 pm UTC (link)
	Post a note to cotton - she knows from her H_o_H experience. (Replies frozen)(Parent)(Thread)

	ghetto_booty 2005-11-18 10:25 pm UTC (link)
	Whoa, I watch too much TV. When I saw H_o_H, Head of Household from Big Brother popped into my head. (Replies frozen)(Parent)

eschermobius
2005-11-18 05:09 pm UTC (link)

I think part of the issue with people freaking out on you is that you didn't post all the background info telling us how bad his condition was. as you now know, it is VERY rare for demodectic mange to be something a dog is euthanized for. rare, but not impossible-if he was in that bad of condition, then he was eithanized because it was kinder than letting him suffer with only a partial chance for ever getting any better.

(nor did you mention that you were pregnant and thus emotionally sensitive.)

however, that still doesn't address the issue that you let two known-to-be-unaltered dogs interact to the point of mating, and are now letting the girl carry pups when you KNOW the father of them has an inheritable disease that he DIED for having a really bad case of. That I personally find a bit irresponsible. There is a VERY good chance that those puppies will have mange too....and that would be even more heartbreaking than titan's own story. Putting titan down must have been hard, but can you imagine having a newborn, having newborn pups that are memories of Titan himself, having them all get sick one by one, and knowing some of them will never get better, and will suffer their whole lives?

I'm very sad to hear about titan's case, that was truly a tragedy that someone (not you) let him go that long without vet care. you did an awesome thing in taking him in and taking him to vet after vet.

please, consider this pregnant dog very carefully. The pups have a very good chance of having the same life their dad did.

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dapperscavenger
2005-11-19 03:17 am UTC (link)

Wow. I didn't know mange could be transmitted to unborn pups! That's horrible!

I've never seen mange, ever. If a dog came to me with it I might recognise it from tv programmes, but I might not. I certainly wouldn't know anything about it without a bit of research and I would've taken my vets word as gospel. They are the voice of authority. They have degrees n letters n stuff.

It is a very sad and difficult situation, but the past is the past. Jigbabygirl - Rally your strength of heart and remember that even if you have made a mistake, you can still concentrate on determining what future action(s) are best.

I for one would say that the mange situation was not your fault. You did all the right things but were let down by incompetent vets. I feel that the breeding was a mistake, however, but it takes a lot of courage to come and ask for help from an open forum when you know you've made a mistake.

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	jjgbabygirl 2005-11-19 07:21 am UTC (link)
	thank you. & I didn't purposely try to breed, I was planning on getting Roxi & Titan both fixed but Titan was looking so bad that I was concentrating on that. & especially being pregnant I just cant bring myself to kill the unboen puppies. but anyway, thank you for your kind words, I'm glad a few people in this community are as understanding as I thought they were (Replies frozen)(Parent)

jjgbabygirl
2005-11-19 07:36 am UTC (link)

I didn't post the whole background info in the post for several reasons. I've posted in the past about his condition, and I didn't know that there would be so much debate on what killed him so I didn't think I had to post the entire background again. I thought people would understand that I just lost my buddy & be more supportive. Ok that being said I'm glad I know what to look for with dermadex now, i'm glad to know that it isn't deadly unless it gets as bad as Titan's was. but they did not have to act as if I just sat there & let him die without trying to help. he was one of my best friends, he was my "mr howdy." I did everything I knew to do to help him. The 1st vets let me down & by the time I found the last vet he was too bad to help, I'd give anything to have my dog back. as for the pregnant Roxi, I now know exactly what needs to be done if the puppies end up getting mange. I now know that it can be treated if it doesnt get as bad as Titan got. but especially being pregnant myself I cant bring myself to kill the unborn puppies. The mistake was made now I have to handle it but I cant do that. thank you for not attacking me & commenting much kinder than previous people.

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eschermobius
2005-11-19 08:38 am UTC (link)

Titan was a tragedy, but not your fault. I am truly sorry to hear his story.

The important thing now is that you realize that his puppies will likely have mange, and that they need to be treated as soon as they start showing signs.

I don't know how far along your own pregnancy is, nor your dog's pregnancy, but I can tell you this: it's a lot of work to have sick puppies and a newborn. best of luck! you're gonna have your hands full and a half...

maybe you'll get lucky and they won't inherit his immune problems, and then won't get mange, but keep your eyes out for it. the sooner it's treated, the better a chance they have.

and if they do end up having it, make sure to let any buyer know. it's a lifelong condition in titan's version.

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	buboniclou 2005-11-18 05:51 pm UTC (link)
	I'm sorry you felt you had to leave. Maybe you can rejoin in the future when things settle down a bit for you and Roxi. I really hope things turn out for the best, hon. (Replies frozen)(Thread)

	jjgbabygirl 2005-11-19 07:38 am UTC (link)
	thanks, I may come back in the future, once I've had my baby & life has settled down because until then I cant handle the drama. until then I'll be watching from the sidelines. Thanks again. (Replies frozen)(Parent)

	heaterz0r 2005-11-18 08:39 pm UTC (link)
	i just wanted to say good luck. You did the best you could, with what you thought was right. One thing i have to say though... if those puppies come at the same time your baby does (or close to it), you're gonna be really overwhelmed. But good luck anyway. (Replies frozen)(Thread)

	jjgbabygirl 2005-11-19 07:14 am UTC (link)
	thanks, the puppies will be coming in about January & my son is not due until the begginning of April so the puppies will be about 2 months old by the time the baby is born. (Replies frozen)(Parent)(Thread)

cottonmanifesto
2005-11-19 10:11 am UTC (link)

Please, please, PLEASE consider that the pups will be 8 weeks old (and pit bulls tend to have very large litters, usually 10 or more pups) when your son is a newborn. While 8 weeks old is too young to be separated from mom and littermates, it will be extremely difficult for you to deal with the messes 10 pups make along with dealing with the needs of your baby. Please try to imagine trying to clean up after 10 pups while being 8 months pregnant and barely able to bend over. You will already be uncomfortable and exhausted. Taking care of newborn pups will add to that a thousand times over.

I know that

lovelydenial has offered her help, please accept it - it's in the best interest of your dog, yourself, your family, and your baby.

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yesididit
2005-11-18 11:35 pm UTC (link)

i'm sorry to hear your dog got so ill. it sounds like you did the best you could with what you were told by the different vets. yes, ultimately your dog died because you didnt know better, as did mine.

but knowing that and having everyone blame and flame you right now is not going to undo the dogs illness and passing.

now is your time to grieve. i'm so sorry the vets were unable to diagnose it sooner. by sharing your story with us, now you know more about dermodex and so do those of us who have never had to deal with it. perhaps one day this information will help to save another dog.

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	jjgbabygirl 2005-11-19 07:18 am UTC (link)
	thank you for yuor kind words. Didn't you have to have your dog put to sleep after she bit you? It's so hard to make that decision. I thought the community would be supportive, and a few were. Thank you. (Replies frozen)(Parent)

stargazerlily44
2005-11-19 09:22 pm UTC (link)

Hi there, I didn't read your first post, but all I can say is how sorry I am for your loss. It's so hard to know what's right and wrong, especially when it's a vet, who you're supposed to be able to trust, telling it to you. I also wanted to let you know that I co-run a rescue here in Calgary, AB, and if you need a place to re-home the pups to we'd be happy to take them. We are a no-kill organization, and our city has nowhere near the Pit Bull problem that some places in NC do. I hope that all goes well with the pups, and like I said if you need homes for them you're more than welcome to call us, and we'll set something up.
Good luck with your pregnancy, it's such an amazing thing to have a child. Our second is due in July. :o)
-Angela
Pit Bulls For Life
www.PitBullsForLife.com

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