Plucky Communist Fairy Princess ([info]tikae) wrote in [info]feminist,
@ 2005-11-14 17:25:00
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Current mood: chipper
Entry tags:privilege, privilege checklists

Non-Poor Privilege Checklist
Currently, we have The White Privilege Checklist, The Male Privilege Checklist, The Non-Fat Privilege Checklist, The Straight Privilege Checklist, The Non-Trans Privilege Checklist, and The Non-Disabled Privilege Checklist.

And since we've had some excellent wealth-related discussions here and in other communities recently, I'd like to see a non-poor or wealth privilege checklist created here for reference. The primary difference from the other checklists is that someone with a particular income is always going to have advantages over someone with a lower income, advantages that are not results of social bias. I don't think direct privileges like "I have the privilege to buy lots of stuff!" need to be listed. However, if there's something that might not be obvious that goes along with, say, the ability to buy a car or such, feel free to list that. There are all kinds of indirect or partly-direct privileges related to this.

Middle class is a vague enough starting point, please make a note if the privilege you're listing applies to the rich (aka the upper-upper-middle-class) in particular.

My examples are largely US-focused (though they certainly apply to other countries) because that's the country I'm most familiar with. Please list what country or countries (yes, US included!) you're discussing when listing examples.

If you can post citations for more specific examples, all the better. For example, I know that poorer neighborhoods have worse access to libraries, parks, etc than richer neighborhoods, but I have no idea how precisely great the difference is.

And finally, I'm not doing this for school or anything, just for reference in general.




Direct ---> Indirect in these examples means that a direct result of non-poor privilege - being able to afford - leads to an indirect privilege, which I'd count as either something that the person with that privilege does not have to worry about or may have never considered (as in example 1) or something that can lead them to judge the worth of people who cannot afford . Probably an unecessary descriptor, but I can clean it up later.

NON-POOR PRIVILEGE CHECKLIST:

1. (Direct ---> Indirect) I have the privilege of buying what I want to eat every day and night, rather than looking for the cheapest food and best deals.

2. (Political/Attitude Direct ---> Indirect) I have the privilege of boycotting certain stores because I disagree with them politically or personally, as well as the privilege of looking down on people who do not boycott those stores.

3. (Poorly worded Direct ---> Indirect) I have the privilege to purchase small luxuries like CDs or Frappuccinos, as well as the privilege to look down on poor people who do the same. I have the privilege to look down on them because I can believe that if they saved $5-30 a month on these luxuries, they wouldn't be poor, OR that if they have the $5-30 a month to spend on these luxuries, they cannot truly count as poor.

4. (Indirect) I have the privilege of deciding what counts as "luxuries," from food types to entertainment options.

5. (Partly Direct) I have the privilege of opening a bank account, and possibly the privilege of avoiding monthly "maintenance" fees, as most banks charge $4-8 a month if a member's checkings or savings accounts drop below a certain amount of money.




(Post a new comment)


[info]welsey
2005-11-15 12:37 am UTC (link)
This is somewhat along the lines of what you're looking for, it is a "class privilege" checklist written by Will Barratt and can be found here

SES Privilege – W. Barratt, Ph.D.
Social Class Privilege Checklist for the Upper Social Classes
1. I don’t need to worry about learning the social customs of others.
2. The ‘better people’ are in my social group.
3. It is likely that my career and financial success will be attributed to my hard work.
4. People appear to pay attention to my social class.
5. When I am shopping, people usually call me “Sir” or “Ma’am”.
6. When making a purchase with a check or credit card, my appearance doesn’t create
problems.
7. When I, or my children, are taught about history, people from my social class are
represented in the books.
8. I can easily speak with my attorney or physician.
9. There are neighborhoods I can move to where I feel ‘at home’.
10. There are places where I can be among those exclusively from my social class.
11. I can deny Social Class Privilege by asserting that all social classes are essentially the
same.
12. Experts appearing on mass media are from my social class.
13. There are stores that market especially to people from my social class.
14. I can protect myself and my children from people who may not like us based on my
social class.
15. Law enforcement officials will likely assume I am a non-threatening person once they see
me and hear me.
16. Disclosure of my work and education may actually help law enforcement officials
perceive me as being “in the right” or “unbiased.”
17. I can easily speak to my child’s college professors.
18. My citizenship and immigration status will likely not be questioned, and my background
will likely not be investigated, because of my social class.
19. I can be sure that my social class will be an advantage when seeking medical or legal
help.
20. If I wish to my children to private schools, I have a variety of options.
21. I can find colleges that have many people from my social class as students and that
welcome me or my child.
22. If I apply for a prestige job competing with people of a lower class, my social class will
be to my advantage.
23. The decision to hire me will be related to my background and where I went to school.
24. When I watch TV or read the papers I can see people of my own class represented well.
25. The “Newsmakers” are like me.
26. I deserve my status because of my accomplishments.
27. If I get offered a job over someone with more experience, it is because I deserve it.
28. My elected representatives share a similar background with mine.
29. Chances the person in charge in any organization is like me or is sympathetic to my
status.
30. My child is never ignored in school, and if there are problems, I am called by the teacher
or principle.
31. People are usually careful with their language and grammar around me.

It's a little different than what you were starting to list out, and I think your suggestions were on to something really good. I think you and other members here should continue to list things along those lines as well.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]quitelife00
2005-11-15 12:45 am UTC (link)
30. My child is never ignored in school, and if there are problems, I am called by the teacher or principle.
31. People are usually careful with their language and grammar around me.

*snort* Those two seem to contradict each other.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 01:06 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 01:08 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bestdaywelived, 2005-11-15 02:44 am UTC

[info]tikae
2005-11-15 12:47 am UTC (link)
Oooh, bunches of examples. Yeah, that's a good start, thanks!

Some of those should definitely be fleshed out more or changed. "There are places where I can be among those exclusively from my social class," for example, definitely needs rewording - maybe "There are places where I can be among those exclusively from my social class, and they are generally much safer and better-funded and um better in some other way than places that are exclusively or largely filled with those of lower social classes."

Only conciser. Much.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 01:09 am UTC

[info]chreebomb
2005-11-15 04:33 am UTC (link)
excellent! and thank you!

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]robynchick
2006-06-12 07:18 am UTC (link)
"13. There are stores that market especially to people from my social class."

There are stores that market to nearly all social classes though:
for instance, the 99c stores, thrift stores, discount groceries, etc. often advertise to those of us in a much lower income bracket, even to those with no income.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2006-06-12 11:20 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]robynchick, 2006-06-12 11:22 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2006-06-12 11:27 pm UTC
I have two.
[info]nymphaeales
2005-11-15 12:38 am UTC (link)
1. Not from my perspective, but I've been on the receiving end of some pretty brutal classism lately:

I have the privilege of going to an excellent university along with hordes of other wealthy young people, as well as the privilege of being able to say nasty, judgmental things about working students, students on financial aid, students who do not dress head-to-toe in designer clothes, and poor people in general without having to worry about anyone calling me out for it.

2. From my perspective (we're all guilty, anyway).

I have the privilege of getting an education at a prestigious university and the concurrent privilege of looking down on people who don't go to schools as good as mine.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: I have two.
[info]chiranka
2005-11-15 01:17 am UTC (link)
I have a small antedote to go with your number 1. When I was in 6th grade, I had a friend named Sam who was from a pretty poor family. Her mother worked in Mc Donald's and her father at Radio Shack. I think she told me her father made about a thousand dollars a month, which was to support a family of four people. To anyone with any grasp of monetary skills, it's quite obvious that the combined income of these two parents would not allow for the Tommy Hilfiger clothing and Abercrombie and Fitch crap that was the trend when I was in middle school. But unfortunately for Sam, the sixth grade population at my middle school didn't realize what that little money meant. Sam didn't have great fashion sense and I guess talked a lot, so she didn't have the greatest social skills, which in middle school basically means that you're just plain fucked. I remember vaugely being aware of the fact that her parents didn't have a lot of money, and I came to her defense one time when some girls were saying that "A thousand dollars is still a lot of money! She could still buy better clothes" instead of stuff from Wal-mart or whatever. I wish now that I had supported Sam more, because to hear that kind of shit day in and day out must have been terrible for her. I regret it now, even though it's hard as hell to stand up for yourself in middle school. If there was something that I could change, it would be that I had the courage to really stand up for her and let those rich idiots know how stupid they were being.

I think also some of the stigma of being poor (for children) is the whole competitive nature of middle school. In my experience, everyone tried to bring down everyone else in order to seem cool. You know, you wouldn't be the complete loser of the group if there was someone that even *you* could make fun of. And so, people like Sam were picked on because she couldn't afford nice clothes.

As for college: it completely sucks that you still hear shit like that, 'cause come on, we should be old enough to know that some people don't have money for stuff. I checked your user info and I see that you go to Vanderbilt. I went there for a college visit and I saw that a lot of people there fit the "rich white southern kid" stereotype, on a cursory glance. Hopefully, I was wrong about it, but I go to another rich private Southern school (Duke University) and people here have money. It's crazy to see the Louie Vutton bags and the luxury cars that people drive here, because how many people are lucky enough to be able to spend $300 on a purse? People seriously make fun of working students? I'm fortunate enough to lucky to have my family pay for my college tutition, but the students who have to work twenty or thirty hours a week have my complete and utter respect because they do everything I do plus another full load of work. Maybe it's just a private school thing?

Oh, do you have this stigma at Vanderbilt? A lot of students here say stuff about how public school kids have it so much easier, etc, etc, which is true in a sense because Duke is a really hard school, but I took summer classes at a public Florida college and even though the classes are less difficult, the people who attend these schools probably work twice or three times as much as a lot of my peers at Duke. I couldn't fathom taking all the classes that I did plus having to go home and cook dinner for a family, go to PTA meetings, work a full-time job, and still do school work.

Blech, this was long. XD

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 01:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chiranka, 2005-11-15 01:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 02:05 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chiranka, 2005-11-15 02:15 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 02:25 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 02:09 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]trinityva, 2005-11-15 02:03 am UTC

(Deleted post)
(no subject) - [info]trinityva, 2005-11-15 02:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chiranka, 2005-11-15 02:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]trinityva, 2005-11-15 02:21 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 02:22 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]trinityva, 2005-11-15 02:26 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 02:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]trinityva, 2005-11-15 02:43 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 03:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ceilidh, 2005-11-15 03:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chiranka, 2005-11-15 04:43 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chiranka, 2005-11-15 04:43 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]nymphaeales, 2005-11-15 10:44 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 11:07 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]nymphaeales, 2005-11-15 11:22 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 11:37 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]nymphaeales, 2005-11-15 11:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 11:50 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]oneofthemnow, 2005-11-16 03:32 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-16 10:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-16 10:04 pm UTC
Re: I have two. - [info]nymphaeales, 2005-11-15 10:39 pm UTC

[info]xmorningxrosex
2005-11-15 12:43 am UTC (link)
[Being Poor]

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]seekingsartre
2005-11-15 12:51 am UTC (link)
Wow. That was really intense.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(no subject) - [info]tikae, 2005-11-15 01:10 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 01:11 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chiranka, 2005-11-15 01:26 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]xmorningxrosex, 2005-11-15 03:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]nosmokegirl, 2005-11-15 01:50 am UTC
I AM POOR - [info]foursixths, 2005-11-15 03:28 am UTC
Re: I AM POOR - [info]xmorningxrosex, 2005-11-15 03:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]crafting_change, 2005-11-15 04:15 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chreebomb, 2005-11-15 04:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]dawiskadabatta, 2005-11-15 05:17 pm UTC

[info]seekingsartre
2005-11-15 12:44 am UTC (link)
People of means have the privilege of getting their medical needs met while wondering why people without means "aren't concerned about thier health."

Also, there is the whole thing where people of means are able to critisize people without means for "not making healthy food choices" when the fact is that they don't necesarily have access to them.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]ceejayoz
2005-11-15 12:57 am UTC (link)
Your second point is a really good one that doesn't get stressed enough. Fast food generally costs significantly less than "healthy food" does, unless you're lucky enough to live near a good farmer's market or the like.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 01:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]brienf, 2005-11-15 02:00 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]xmorningxrosex, 2005-11-15 03:42 am UTC

[info]drunkenatheist
2005-11-15 12:49 am UTC (link)
2. (Political/Attitude Direct ---> Indirect) I have the privilege of boycotting certain stores because I disagree with them politically or personally, as well as the privilege of looking down on people who do not boycott those stores.

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU.

PS- Thank you.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]chiranka
2005-11-15 12:53 am UTC (link)
Oh, like in the terms of Wal-mart, which is known for shitty treatment of its employers? But it's still a cheaper option than shopping at another place, so that's where some people just have to go?

Sorry, it just took me a few minutes to think of an example for this one. You have any others?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]timetokill, 2005-11-15 01:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chiranka, 2005-11-15 02:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]trinityva, 2005-11-15 02:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chiranka, 2005-11-15 02:21 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bestdaywelived, 2005-11-15 01:02 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]tikae, 2005-11-15 01:09 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]akfelecia2, 2005-11-15 01:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ceilidh, 2005-11-15 01:16 am UTC

[info]bestdaywelived
2005-11-15 01:01 am UTC (link)
Here's a good one:

You think health insurance is a necessity.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]tikae
2005-11-15 01:12 am UTC (link)
Or "I have the privilege of believing that health insurance is a necessity for myself, but not for people who can't afford it."

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]timetokill, 2005-11-15 01:56 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]tikae, 2005-11-15 01:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]timetokill, 2005-11-15 02:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]tikae, 2005-11-15 02:05 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]aeiou, 2005-11-15 02:08 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]timetokill, 2005-11-15 02:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chiranka, 2005-11-15 02:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]belladonna_, 2005-11-15 04:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]aeiou, 2005-11-15 02:57 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]miss_cute_boots, 2005-11-15 05:10 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bestdaywelived, 2005-11-15 02:49 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]savestheworld, 2005-11-16 06:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]trufflepig, 2005-11-15 01:26 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]drunkenatheist, 2005-11-15 03:01 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]pepperedmoth, 2005-11-15 06:55 pm UTC

[info]jennifer0246
2005-11-15 01:25 am UTC (link)
totally, especially on the boycotting stores one. i had someone who works as a nurse-practitioner tell me that i shouldn't shop at walmart, there are always other alternatives, she says.

and another occasion, i was talked with a group about our first vehicles, and i mentioned that i was lucky enough that my parents had given me a small suv (it was a 10 year old beat up old thing, but it ran, which was the point). a woman in the group tells me i shouldn't have driven it, think about the environment, she says. my bad, i'll ask my parents for a nice environmentally-friendly volvo next time (which is what her parents gave her when she turned 16).

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]ruggerdavey
2005-11-15 01:48 am UTC (link)
The Walmart thing is a particular issue here becaase there's nowhere else to shop unless you drive pretty freaking far. And since I only have the school van that goes to the mall, walmart, and stop n shop, where else am I supposed to go? I'm certainly not spending an arm and a leg in the local shops right in the middle of campus.

But, yeah, I'd love to shop elsewhere, but I can't freaking afford it.

One of the kids I TA here runs the college Green Party. Instead of shopping at Walmert, he rides his bike to Bennington. It's only 15-20 miles, he says. Cue me laughing hysterically. Yeah, because I can totally ride that far. Except not.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]welsey, 2005-11-15 02:30 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ruggerdavey, 2005-11-15 04:30 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]krazyhippie, 2005-11-15 04:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ruggerdavey, 2005-11-15 04:36 am UTC

[info]trufflepig
2005-11-15 01:36 am UTC (link)
US based white privilege:

i can be pretty sure that when i listen to the radio, open a newspaper, or turn on the tv, my language will be spoken/written.

when i turn on the tv, there will be a good number of networks with varying content based at many age groups and gender demographics of my race. if i were another race, there would be only one or two networks available with marginalized programming that has to suit all demographics of my race.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]timetokill
2005-11-15 02:04 am UTC (link)
:\
This post is about "not-poor" privilege, not white privilege.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]lolacat
2005-11-15 02:16 am UTC (link)
(From a perspective of US middle class white privelege, having been on the bad end of the stick, income wise)....

When I talk with others in social settings, I can be sure that I will know about and can participate in discussions of the current events and issues in our society because I have access to media sources such as television, the internet, radio, and newspapers.

I can be sure that I can get to my workplace, a grocery store, a doctor, etc, in a timely fashion (not have to wait an hour for a bus, transfer buses, or have to walk, because I have a car).

I can be sure that owning a home is achievable because I can save towards a down payment.

I can be sure that if I want to send my child to a day care, I will have a range of choices and options rather than only choosing from subsidized care centers.

I can be sure that I will have school supplies on hand at all times for my schoolwork.

I can be sure that missing a bill payment is an inconveniencing mistake, and not a crisis.

I can be sure that if my car breaks down or I miss my bus, I can call someone to pick me up by payphone or cell phone.

I can be sure that I can run the heater during the freezing winters here in Iowa.

I can be sure that I can participate in extra-curricular activites like a yoga class, dance class, or music lessons... because I have time to, and because I can afford to.

I can care for pets.

(Reply to this)


[info]boigrrrlwonder
2005-11-15 03:48 am UTC (link)
gah! really want to read the non-disabled checklist but it says the link is broken...would you mind posting it?

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]tikae
2005-11-15 04:02 am UTC (link)
http://www2.edc.org/WomensEquity/edequity/hypermail/1180.html

Works fine for me, though.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(no subject) - [info]krazyhippie, 2005-11-15 04:04 am UTC

[info]xmorningxrosex
2005-11-15 03:59 am UTC (link)
Also, to add to the being poor thing I posted earlier...these are some of the things I've experienced in the past couple of years (and I say these as someone who is in grad school and has loads of privilege in comparison to others, I just understand it better nowadays).

being poor is getting dirty looks as you pull out your foodstamp card

being poor is realizing how much the stigmatization and stereotyping is that even as a social worker, you're uncomfortable admitting that you're on foodstamps in a classroom full of other social workers

being poor is relying on your state to provide your birth control because you can't afford the sliding scale fees at Planned Parenthood

being poor is deciding to get long-term birth control (yay iuds), because you don't know when you'll be able to afford having a kid/getting an abortion should something screw up, and don't want to pay monthly fees for new prescriptions

being poor is pulling your own teeth out because you can't go to the dentist (my dad did this)

being poor means not eating dinner so that your kids have enough food (thanks mom)

being poor means sharing beds, sharing a bedroom, sharing clothes with a couple siblings, and not having a real bed...just mattresses on the floor

being poor is not being able to afford to move to a safer or better area

being poor means wondering if you can apply to an apartment you like, because they require you make 3x more than the amount of rent and you know you don't

being poor means having to ask for help

being poor often means giving up personal info (ie. filling out applications for foodstamps, housing voucher programs, meeting with a social worker, getting free BC, etc.) that you wouldn't even feel comfortable talking about with friends/family

being poor means having people judge what you spend your money on (be it getting drunk as a coping mechanism when you're homeless or indulging in some comfort junk food or buying your kid toys) because some rich people think you should only spend your money on the necessities.

being poor means handmedowns, even if they're stained, in need of repair, ill-fitting, and trying to make it work as something "professional"

being poor is washing your clothes in the bathtub because you can't afford the $2 for washer/dryer

being poor means accepting whatever you can get, at the cost of your pride at times

being poor means being desperate for any job. even if it's crappy pay, long hours, over 40 hours per week, not something you're interested in, or degrading

If you'd like some more ideas, you should check out the comm poor_skills

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]chreebomb
2005-11-15 04:44 am UTC (link)
being poor is not being able to afford to move to a safer or better area

being poor means wondering if you can apply to an apartment you like, because they require you make 3x more than the amount of rent and you know you don't

being poor means having to ask for help

being poor often means giving up personal info (ie. filling out applications for foodstamps, housing voucher programs, meeting with a social worker, getting free BC, etc.) that you wouldn't even feel comfortable talking about with friends/family


yes yes yes.

good stuff.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]ruggerdavey
2005-11-15 04:40 am UTC (link)
Being poor is having the most humiliating experience of your life be when a bill collector hears you ask your mom whether to say she's home or not and confronts you about it as if you are some evil lying sack of shit.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]fishpaw
2005-11-15 07:57 am UTC (link)
This happened to me once. It sucks. I used to get into so many arguments with this one bill collector, it was insane.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]ruggerdavey, 2005-11-15 04:51 pm UTC

[info]lifeisacabaret
2005-11-15 04:53 am UTC (link)
Being poor means:

- I have precious little choice in what I wear - I am great at thrift store buying and altering things and getting hand me downs, but I am definitely fashion limited... and I love fashion.

- I cut my own hair and dye it every now and then... when I dye it I keep half of the dye for next time

- My dental plan is making sure I replace my toothbrush often and brush several times a day and floss daily, and still my dental plan is also all too often cheap store brand acetominophen or ibuprofen

- I don't have the option of "eating ethically" via free range, organics, etc. I eat the cheap crap that is ethically the very worst. This goes for coffee and chocolate as well... ethics can only come into it via simply denying myself these things

- I don't have the option of eating "low carb" - most of my diet is rice, pasta, etc. because I can't afford fresh veggies/meats in the quantities that would facilitate my eating well

- Forget supplements or vitamins... dream on

- It's very difficult to build a credit rating when you don't have credit cards because you are horrified of spending money you don't have

- I will pretty much always wake up in pain after sleeping on my old, tired mattress

- Everyting "nice" that I have (vintage furniture, etc) is chipped, torn, or somehow damaged... that's how I could afford it.

- I can't buy gifts, and not everyone is crazy about something hand made

- I have a hard time going out... I go to a movie maybe 3 or 4 times a year, out for dinner is rare, out for coffee is about as good as it gets for me.... or for walks. - I love to go dancing, but most nightclubs have a cover charge which means I can't do it often - and I almost never can buy a drink while there

- I am not "earthquake prepared" by any stretch. When the big one comes I won't have first aid supplies, food, etc. I do keep a large bottle filled with tap water just in case.

- I have to drink tap water, dammit.

- I only have one pair of shoes

- I have to take advantage of all the low income social programs I can in order to be sure that my son has everything I can get him in terms of being able to go swimming, ice skating, field trips at school, and almost always this means having to go through a "qualification process" that is invasive

- I have to live in rentals that are cheap, which often means having slum-lord landlords, and currently means living in a "character" place that has no laundry, ancient unsafe gas stove, sinks and tub chipped (I forgive the tub, it's a huge clawfoot, heh) and that kind of thing... it's really run down but I tell myself it's got so much character just so that I can cope with it... now it is being torn down to build new condos so I have to try to finance a move... and find another place I can afford in this area so my son can stay in the same school.

- When I had a car it was a $200 one with no heat or speedometer and had loads of holes and quirks, the same applies to my bike when I had it

- I have sometimes had to be late on assignments for school or hand in something I wasn't happy with because I couldn't afford to buy materials to do the project

- I can't afford to pass by the "markdown bin" in the grocery store... there may be something there that I need but can't afford at full price

- My dad is dying and the only way that I can fly out to visit him is to accept help from a family member who I had resolved to cut off completely from - I don't have the luxury of my own effing convictions

- My school has great field trips and exchange opportunities... none that I can afford

- When I lived far from school I often was late and sometimes even missed school because my car broke down or I couldn't afford gas

- I have had to constantly juggle which bill isn't going to get paid this month, so that no one company disconnects me, but they all hate me

- Basically being poor means this: for you to live with some (not by a long shot all) of the bare bones basics that are generally considered "neccessities," you have to live beyond your means and deal with the stress of living beyond your means

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[info]dawiskadabatta
2005-11-15 05:24 pm UTC (link)
- I have had to constantly juggle which bill isn't going to get paid this month, so that no one company disconnects me, but they all hate me




yep. "which one was I late on last time?"

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[info]kwellerific
2005-11-15 07:25 am UTC (link)
i'm studying to be a teacher and my boyfriend is a teacher. he was in the public school system for his education, but when it came time to apply for jobs, a private middle school gave the best benefits. we live in texas, where teachers have ridiculously low salaries. (that's another post all together!)

according to him, the 7th graders he teaches already have terrible stereotypes about public schools formed. interestingly enough, when they found out where i went to school and where i currently go to university (all public, by the way) they had no "complaints" about those schools.

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[info]softanimal
2005-11-15 10:36 am UTC (link)
i have a serious, potentially debilitating chronic illness (chronic lyme disease), which for a variety of complex reasons is politically contentious in terms of both diagnosis and treatment. most insurance companies will not cover even half of what it takes to get well (or relatively well) from this disease (usually 1 - 5 years of treatment, or thereabouts), leaving *so many people* incredibly sick, disabled, without proper treatment/medication. in fact, a large percentage of patients must pay fully out of pocket - we're talking thousands and thousands of dollars per year for longterm antibiotics and a myriad of necessary supplements. i am incredibly lucky in that i have a wealthy grandfather who has agreed to finance my treatment. without him, i'd be screwed, probably sick for the rest of my life. there are so many lyme patients left in the dust; many of them whole families with lyme, unable to afford treatment for their children, let alone themselves. the situation is absolutely criminal.

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[info]ruggerdavey
2005-11-15 04:58 pm UTC (link)
I know that one through my own dad. Nont lyme disease but hemophilia. He can't take the Factor VIII meds that would make his life easier because they're so expensive and he's way too close to the cap on his insurance as it is (this is the second policy he's had from his old employer - he's retired - as he got horribily sick once and ran out of insurance while in the hospital). He just found out he has hepatitis, and now he has to decide whether to get treatment not only based on possible side effects but whether the monetary cost is worth it as well.

So, yes, you are too right. The state of insurance in this country IS absolutely criminal.

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(no subject) - [info]savestheworld, 2005-11-16 05:50 pm UTC

[info]naath
2005-11-15 11:53 am UTC (link)
Personally I am a 'poor student' from a Middle class background.

I have the privallege of knowing that the income I can expect as a graduate will be more than sufficient to repay the loans I need to get the degree, I have the privallege of believing that this sort of loan is acceptable and the privallege of being able to ignore the huge sums of money involved.

(A *lot* of poor people in this country, the UK, have been hugely affected by tuition fees (just introduced) because whilst the loan is a)reasonable and b)ought to be easy to repay after you get a good job and you don't have to untill you *have* the good job and to a middle class person this all looks fine to a lot of poorer people the concept of borowing that much money is just Too Much)

I have the privallege of expecting that I will some day own my own home and thus the will to tie up money as 'saving for a house' (even when I don't have much money) thus increasing my liklihood of actually being able to afford a home.

A note... Yes, clearly, poor people have less money but I think that there are also differences in the perception of money between the rich and the poor that make their issues different. I'm not convinced that giving everyone the ability to buy CDs is a huge social problem (the ability to buy food on the other hand *is*) but I do feel that it is something that people need to remember when talking to poorer people is that not everyone has that spare money to spend on a CD or a meal out just because 'you' (generic) have that money every day/week/month.

Internationally...

The privallege of living in a rich country means that I expect to have clean water to drink and to wash in, a sewage system that takes the sewage away without contaminating the drinking water, food that I can buy so I don't have to grow/catch it, and all this withing a half hour's walk from my centrally heated house that I have a reasonable expectation will never be 'overcrowded' from my Western point of view.

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[info]amphibian23
2005-11-15 12:37 pm UTC (link)
i have the privilege of not being looked at as a benefit scrounger if i have kids.

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[info]suziecroft
2005-11-15 02:33 pm UTC (link)
Not from my POV, but attitudes I've encountered from others:

I can afford to own, run, and maintain a "nice" car... or just a car, period.

If for any reason I do not own a car, or do not wish to drive it, I can afford to take public transport or hire a taxi.

I can believe that anyone who does not have a job is too lazy to get one. I can also believe that anybody who does not have a job that pays higher than my local minimum wage is simply not trying hard enough to get one.

I have never lost sleep over my bank balance.

If I get into debt for any reason, I can be sure I will be able to repay it promptly.


And while we're making lists of privilege lists: Christian Privilege.

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[info]lifeisacabaret
2005-11-16 02:11 am UTC (link)
Thanks for posting the xian one.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(no subject) - [info]savestheworld, 2005-11-16 05:47 pm UTC

[info]pepperedmoth
2005-11-15 07:21 pm UTC (link)
I find it interesting how folks' ideas of what a 'luxury' is expand and contract depending on how much money they have. I have a friend who sees eating out once a week, buying makeup, and getting new CDs as outright necessities. It drives me nuts. A 'luxury' to her is a dinner at an elegant restaurant as opposed to just a normally priced one (Olive Garden would not be a luxury to her; a four star restaurant would be.)

To me, getting a cup of tea at a coffee shop is a luxury. But I really don't think of myself as poor. I have to comparison shop for food madly and am always mildly panicked at the end of the month trying to make ends meet (I passionately hate having to ask for help), but when I am short at the end of the month, my housemates help me. When I lost my job and couldn't manage rent, my family was able to cushion me. I don't have to fear being homeless, and that is a huge privilege.

It's funny in some ways. I am pleased that I can take such luxurious delight in such small things (a cup of tea, for instance). This is another privilege, though one of outlook rather than money.

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[info]savestheworld
2005-11-16 05:38 pm UTC (link)
can i contribute as a middle class person? off the top of my head:
-politicians/parties want my vote and assume i'm 'responsible' enough to vote
-academic works are written by people like me
-i can browse at a store and not buy anything without appearing suspicious
-i can receive tax breaks and refunds without being accused of leeching off americans
-i can start a business
-there are banks in my neighborhood (this one really bugs me)
-if i leave my job when i have a baby, i'm not accused of being lazy and leeching off everyone else, but rather responsible (err... sometimes)

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[info]odd_duck_out
2005-11-18 05:28 pm UTC (link)
I'm not going to promise to format this quite right for your list, but just share some things that have affected me as someone whose parents were very poor growing up but who have ended up middle class.

- Crossing class boundaries means being constantly aware and constantly hiding, the economic equivalent of the "pronoun game" faced by the queer. I look at this list and see things like reusing teabags or always buying off-brand or in thrift shops and those are things that were standard in my childhood, and that I didn't realize weren't normal until I went to a high school full of richer kids. The first time someone sneered in genuine confusion and derision -- "Wait, buying a coat from Salvation Army -- isn't that for poor people?" I started to realize that not everyone followed what I thought was frugality, and I started to hide class markers like that.

- Being poor means always discounting the present so much that you make decisions that keep you in poverty. You buy cheap things that don't last as long, because you can't trust so much money in one item. Or, you can't get a fair loan to buy an expensive better deal up front.

- Crossing class boundaries means hiding your consumption from the people in your past. I take cabs occasionally, and own a lot of books. I hide this from my parents because I am ashamed to indulge in what were always seen as impossible luxuries.

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[info]bleedingcherub
2006-06-12 02:54 pm UTC (link)
The first time someone sneered in genuine confusion and derision -- "Wait, buying a coat from Salvation Army -- isn't that for poor people?"

Some years ago, my MOTHER said this. I jawdropped and made her come with me. Now she's as fiendishly second-hand as I am.

On this note, a privilege for the list:

-Being able to dress in second-hand clothes or furnish my house with older furniture for fun or irony rather than necessity.

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