Elusis ([info]elusis) wrote in [info]fatshionista,
@ 2008-06-18 03:32:00
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There have been some good posts lately in the fatosphere about some of the OMG OBESITY implications of WALL-E.

Well, as I posted in response to [info]stitchtowhere's post,I saw a screening tonight. I would say the character concept has changed from the October reference (and talking with the friend at Pixar who got me in, that is indeed the case - "we had some problems with the humans" in the initial concept, he said.)

Humans, at least the ones of 2700, are not the villains, and obesity is not the cause of the Earth's demise (the people shown fleeing Earth in the past are all depicted as slim). It is consumption, and the trash produced by an endless array of consumable goods, that destroys the earth. While I wouldn't say the portrayal that made it to screen is size-positive, the year 2700 humans are pretty friendly and supportive of WALL-E. There is even a brief scene with a newly-formed couple frolicking (fatly) in the pool, which is pretty flirtatious in a way I thought was charming.

My Pixar friend said that essentially, the idea is that humanity was supposed to spend just 5 years on the luxury spaceship, but got trapped for 700 years, and because of the super-artificial situation (it was meant to be a total vacation to recruit people into going), got dependent in an artificial way. Originally they were apparently designed to be rather more gross and creepy, and had no intelligible lines; both of those were changed by the team working on the movie because of concerns about what it would suggest about fat people.

Now, the equation of sloth + fast food = fatties is still at the heart of this, and is undeniably problematic. There is a bit where one of the humans is knocked out of his floating chair and can't get up without help, so he just flops around on the floor like a turtle on its back or a huge infant. That really sucks.

But I would say that I liked the film much more than I'd expected based on reading the warnings about it. And I am impressed that Pixar-owned-by-Disney can take what sounds like it was undoubtedly a totally offensive initial character concept, re-work it based on concerns about size-ism, and make an improvement, even if it's not ultimately ideal. The friend whom I talked to is a fellow of size himself, and it was clear that he felt loyal to the film but also understood it could still have issues. I'm just glad to know the conversation is even happening inside a media company of this stature.



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[info]dragonflycurls
2008-06-18 01:40 pm UTC (link)
I don't know if I'll see it, just because things like that piss me off. But I think it is remarkable that they did at least re-work it.

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[info]elusis
2008-06-18 08:18 pm UTC (link)
It is a nice bright spot to see the portrayal of fat people get *better* after being run through committee, rather than worse.

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[info]mrsnoname1999
2008-06-18 01:57 pm UTC (link)
I wonder if the shitstorm in the Fatosphere at the end of last year had anything to do with their decision. (I would hope, of course, that they had already seen the flaws in their original plan by then.)

It would have been nice, though, if they had been able to re-work it in such a way that it didn't come across as fatphobic at all. But it's nice to hear that they actually made an effort.

I don't know if I'll see it or not, but if my kids ask to see it... well, maybe now I won't worry about the kind of messages it's going to send QUITE as much.

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[info]elusis
2008-06-18 08:19 pm UTC (link)
No clue whether that was on their radar. But I'm almost more heartened if the critique came from within, which would suggest that a) people inside the company are thinking critically about the messages their films send, and b) management is interested in internal critique, rather than just trying to avoid censure from outside forces.

It is a very sweet movie overall I have to say.

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[info]trollbabe
2008-06-18 03:59 pm UTC (link)
Thank you so much for this. My husband is a total Pixar/Disney fanatic, and he and our kids are completely excited to see this movie. I'd been figuring to at least give it a chance, though I was extremely concerned about what I'd heard about the depiction of fat people in it.

I'm relieved to hear that, while clearly it's not fat-positive, at least it's not liable to be significantly worse than most of the kids' fare out there, which is at least something I can deal with.

Not saying I love it, for the record (and before any flaming begins), but since I can't easily create a fat-positive bubble for my kids to grow up in (alas!), instead I focus on teaching them to be critical of the things they watch. They're only 4, so the teaching has been fairly rudimentary as yet, but that's my mission nonetheless.

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[info]elusis
2008-06-18 08:20 pm UTC (link)
My guess is that you will have cringe-y moments but won't come away feeling like you wished you hadn't gone.

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[info]camisado
2008-06-18 06:46 pm UTC (link)
From this interview, it sounds like the intention wasn't to portray everyone as obese:

"It's funny, I actually tried to avoid obesity. I wanted blobs, I wanted babies. Because in doing research with our, one of the consultants to NASA and his expertise was long term residency in space and the reason we don't send a man out to Mars right now is because if we do, they'll come back with almost no bones because disuse atrophy will kick in with very little gravity and osteoporosis will occur and you will lose a large percentage of your bones, and you'll just be this jello blob.

...

And the whole realization that if you were out in space for that long you would sort of have a lot of bone loss made me feel like wow, you could almost buy that people would be stuck in their beach chairs and we be almost babies. And I thought that was a great metaphor for having to grow up again and stand on your own two feet. And that's what drove it."

It sure doesn't feel that way from the previews, though.. it seemed much more like an "Idiocracy" theme of everyone in the future being fat because we're lazy and eat fast food.

I'm glad it sounds like they're not going in that direction with it.

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[info]elusis
2008-06-18 08:22 pm UTC (link)
Interesting comment from the interview! Their outfits very clearly are a visual reference to babies. But I would say the gravity argument, if it was intended, is not that well portrayed - gravity seems to function fairly normally on the ship (the water stays in the pool, the robots roll along the ground).

There is certainly the equation of fat = sloth + junkfood, but it is a significant improvement over what was described back in October. And the fat humans are empathetic, likeable characters for the most part.

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[info]inkyoctopus
2008-06-18 11:37 pm UTC (link)
Would you mind putting this behind an lj-cut? I really want to see this movie and didn't want to know the WHOLE plot, there might be others that feel the same :-(

Edited at 2008-06-18 11:37 pm UTC

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[info]sixfiftysix
2008-06-19 07:26 am UTC (link)
My thoughts exactly.

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[info]mikomb
2008-06-20 02:00 am UTC (link)
Thank you SO Much for this update, I have been sort of disheartened by the early news that it would be fatphobic and did not know if I even wanted to risk going to see it if I felt like I would need to walk out (one of my new resolutions about body positivity). It's awesome to hear that pixar is giving it consideration. While lazy = fat is still not a great message, I'm relieved that they aren't portrayed as monsters and now I'm looking forward to seeing it.

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