deadbrowalking: Open Letter to Geekdom

Honestly, Truly American (

yeloson) wrote in

deadbrowalking,
@ 2006-08-14 10:48:00

Current mood:	Brick Therapy Time
Current music:	Pharcyde, "It's Jiggaboo Time"

Open Letter to Geekdom
Blackface is unacceptable.

In just this month alone, I've come across 4 seperate situations involving folks in blackface. At ComiCon, there was blackface Storm of the X-men running around. At GenCon, 3 seperate people dressed up as "Drow"(dark elves) and ran around in blackface.

I even asked this girl if she knew the history of blackface, to which she nodded yes. Thankfully, I didn't come across this scene, or else I would be making bail right now.

(The local Indianapolis newspaper had a cover story: "Not Good Enough" - why black folks are unhappy with the city... I can't imagine why...)

Of course, with a simple wikipedia search, you can see how this shit might dredge up bad feelings:

In addition to music and dance, minstrel shows featured comical skits in which performers portrayed buffoonish, lazy, superstitious black characters who were cowardly and lascivious, lusted after white women, who stole, lied pathologically, and mangled the English language.

Even within the D&D iconography, the "drow" are not only blackskinned, but evil, scheming, and (OMG!) matriarchial!

My question is not why you would dress up in Blackface anymore- I've heard all the defenses and rationalizations- my question is now, WHY AREN'T you dressing as the many characters in movies, comics, or anime who either are nazis or look like klansmen?

I mean, they're just characters, right?

(Post a new comment)

hederahelix
2006-08-14 06:29 pm UTC (link)

You know, I've just been thinking about the Drow lately.

I game, not regularly any more, but I do game, and as a stress break I often play Neverwinter Nights (computer version of D&D v 3 forgotten realms). I first started gaming in middle school, so I've seen a lot of incarnations of the D&D books--all the way back to first edition AD&D.

It's not just the Drow--it's pervasive throughout. In the new 3rd and 3.5 edition rules (I missed 2nd edition), most "races" have a "wild" version that is more "barbarian" focused than the "regular" version. Thus, wild elves (at least in Forgotten Realms campaigns), favor more "intuitive" classes like sorcerer over wizard, and they are depicted as tattooed, wearing facepaint, and with feathers in their hair. Unlike the normally pale surface elves, they have dark skin, and instead of taking a hit to their constitution score, they take a hit to their intellegence score. There are also wild dwarves, wild halflings, etc.

Uh huh. Talk about cultural appropriation. I mean, it would be one thing if the wild elves didn't also have darker skin. It just blow my fellow white folks like to forget that we were once tribal too. (Picts anyone?)

While I had heard about Drow years ago, it wasn't like as a teenager I played campaigns with them, so I didn't know about the matriarchal thing until recently, but if you really want a scary examination of the ways in which the matriarchal, eveil, scheming drow are completely problematic, I'd be happy to summarize some of the plots from Neverwinter Nights: Hordes of the Underdark for you.

Right now, though, I have to run and get work done. But I'll check back later.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	yeloson 2006-08-14 08:49 pm UTC (link)
	No need to, I'm generally aware of their issues, my primary concern right now is white people in blackface as being 1000 times more problematic than the fictional stuff. (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

hederahelix
2006-08-15 05:14 pm UTC (link)

I apologize. I misinterpreted the thrust of your annoyance, mostly because seriously the day before you posted, my brain was running in circles on the whole host of ways that Drow are fucked up.

Rereading, I see that the thrust is on the clueless white folks who think it's okay to run around in blackface. I was interpreting the problem as being anyone thinking it was a good idea to put characters in blackface, because if they thought about it for a minute, fans running around in blackface was the likely result.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

	shadowfae 2006-08-14 06:45 pm UTC (link)
	my question is now, WHY AREN'T you dressing as the many characters in movies, comics, or anime who either are nazis or look like klansmen? I mean, they're just characters, right? Amen to THAT. (Reply to this)

	delux_vivens 2006-08-14 07:12 pm UTC (link)
	oh HEYELL no. you know now you have me wondering if these folks are going to start popping up in dreadlock wigs to cosplay ronan dex, right? (Reply to this)

coniraya
2006-08-14 09:03 pm UTC (link)

You want to know why I never really got into gaming despite my geekiness, that's it right there.

That and the fact that in Vampire: the Masquerade (which was the huge RPG in my area when I was coming up) the Brujah (violent street thug vampires for those who don't know) were depicted as a black man. Also the fact that the two Clans of color were some fucking racist caricatures. The Followers of Set (Egypt) were brown people with snakes tattooed on their heads who were all in touch with the magic of their land and had a secret evil plan. The Assamites (Middle East) were evil brown assassins who could spit venom and broke all kinds of laws cause they felt like it. POC seem to be linked to snakes a lot, I guess it's just part of us being close to the earth.
I could whip out other examples but I'd rather not cause I just ate.

Suffice to say anyone who says that in Gaming you escape the real world and there's no racism and all that noise can kiss my drow/brujah ass!

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	coniraya 2006-08-14 09:06 pm UTC (link)
	Sorry forgot my point. Don't they have the Vampire: the Masquerade gatherings? I fear how some of these people would dress and act to represent the Clans o' color. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	yeloson 2006-08-14 09:13 pm UTC (link)
	White Wolf is an ugly half-step with regards to race- much like POC in other media, it's a "step up" that we're actually appearing in material, and a step down that we're portrayed as fucked up stereotypes. That aside- I have games that don't have that shit, and we should play them. (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

	coniraya 2006-08-14 10:14 pm UTC (link)
	I have games that don't have that shit, and we should play them. Yes, we should. I told you I'm cool with doing some gaming. I might need a little tutelage cause I've never done it before but I'd love to get into it. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	lavendertook 2006-08-14 09:32 pm UTC (link)
	Geez. They don't even know there's a clue to look for, and actively resisting finding out. (Reply to this)

	kaizoku 2006-08-15 03:35 am UTC (link)
	Do any cons have rules about this? Cuz it seems like they should (if people are going to be that fucking stupid.) (Reply to this) (Thread)

	lavendertook 2006-08-15 04:00 am UTC (link)
	It depends on whoever is running the particular con not being that stupid either--not something you can count on. /-: (Reply to this) (Parent)

jholloway
2006-08-15 05:48 pm UTC (link)

my question is now, WHY AREN'T you dressing as the many characters in movies, comics, or anime who either are nazis or look like klansmen?

I think some people do; I've certainly seen very Nazi-looking costumes at cons, although maybe not displaying swastikas. And of course there are re-enactors.

I've never seen anyone go as a Klansman, though, presumably because Nazis are all bondage-sexy in a way Klansmen aren't. I honestly don't think any more thought goes into it than that, which is seriously unsettling when you consider the amount of time and effort that goes into putting together one of these costumes by comparison to the amount of thought that apparently goes into thinking about the meaning.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

	yeloson 2006-08-15 05:56 pm UTC (link)
	It seems to me that many people are ok with one, but not the other, so my question is why? There is about as much coverage in the news of people doing blackface at parties as there is about neo-nazi activity, so why is one apparently taboo and not the other? (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

jholloway
2006-08-15 06:39 pm UTC (link)

Good question. I'm not sure. Could it be because Nazis fought the US and therefore distaste for them is common among white people as well? Is it because they represent one of the prejudices that white American culture has, for the most part, genuinely turned its back on? Is it because a random con attendee is more likely to be Jewish than Black? Is it because not everyone is familiar with the history of blackface but most people are familiar with the history of WWII and the Holocaust?

I'm gonna guess that last one; I suspect most cosplayers or LARPers genuinely don't connect what they're doing with the tradition of blackface in minstrel shows and so on. But I suspect they all play a role in it.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

buzzmo
2006-08-16 12:04 am UTC (link)

I think I may be missing something here, which is entirely possible as I am not African-American (but rather Punjabi/German-American). Please forgive my ignorance.

Leaving aside the doof who dressed up as Storm and White "Pimp: the Backhanding" Wolf...

Isn't it worth noting that these people are not in blackface (i.e., minstrels) but simply dressed as drow elves? I.e., they are not dressing up as symbols of real-world hate. Drow may be villains, but they're fictional villains that (for good or ill) people love. Driz'zt is a hero. Slap him (or any drow) on a book and you sell a million copies. Is it the fanboys' fault that drow happen to have jet-black skin? Would the dark blue of Nightcrawler or Mystique be equally offensive?

I mean, if you want to talk about what drow represent, yeah, you can take TSR to task... but you also have to step back 1000 years and include the Norsemen and their svartalfs, too... and then step back another 1000-2000 years to when the patriarchy took over and decreed that light/male = good and dark/female = bad. And if you're going to do that, well... does the guy who dressed up as Darth Vader get taken to task as well?

I mean, it's not "blackface." It's black-colored makeup that lets them pretend to be Driz'zt. Just as red and black makeup would let them be Darth Maul, blue makeup be Beast (or maybe an orge mage), white makeup a zombie or vamp, and orange makeup a ninja cat-girl.

As for dressing up like other hate-related icons... I dunno. At GenCon I saw plenty of people dressed as stormtroopers, Roman legionnaires, ninja, samurai, klingons, undead, soldiers, monsters, slutty chainmail bikini chicks, witches... you name it. But I can't say I saw anyone in "blackface," the same way I didn't see anyone in straight-up KKK or Nazi garb.

Honestly, I'm far more bugged by the continuing need of so many publishers to have half-naked women with big tits somehow involved in selling your product. There was one booth at GenCon selling a game ("Fantasy Empires"?) whose sole selling point seemed to be really good art of naked women. Lame.

Anyway, I may very well be missing the point, and I apologize in advance.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

yeloson
2006-08-16 12:53 am UTC (link)

Hi,

In Germany, let us say that you're buddhist, and you wear a swastika (which, is a legit buddhist symbol), the Germans will tell you it's not acceptable. You may have been thinking of the wheel of karma, but in that context, of that place, it's loaded and hurtful.

In America, for OVER A CENTURY, blackface has been used to demean black folks. And, it's not over, it's in the news.

Americans have less than NO excuse to be unaware of how loaded the image is, to paint oneself black, as much as Germans have less than no excuse to know how loaded Nazi symbols are.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

	buzzmo 2006-08-16 02:06 am UTC (link)
	Okay, that site certainly pissed me off. :( I get what you're saying, Chris. I guess I just also feel bad for Driz'zt fans who I'm sure don't mean any harm, or may even be young enough they just don't get the connection. Thanks for taking me to school, once again. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	buzzmo 2006-08-16 02:15 am UTC (link)
	Oout of curiosity, would using blue or dark purple makeup have been acceptable? (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

yeloson
2006-08-16 02:24 am UTC (link)

As much as the Buddhist Wheel of Karma is acceptable in Germany :P

There are many other layered issues that goe into race discussion, including the concept of "coding" in which a fantasy or sci-fi race is used to represent a real world people.

But of course, if we can't get people to deal with the straight-on obvious stuff, how can we even start talking about stuff like that?

(Reply to this) (Parent)

greyorm
2006-08-25 06:16 pm UTC (link)

Heya,

The Bhuddist can't wear his symbol because the Germans find it offensive and reminds them of a dark time in their history? Consider, as a pagan, as a pagan who has encountered this problem himself (wearing my pentacle here in America), should I have to remove my pentacle in public because the Christians associate it with evil and it bothers them, because it is not acceptable to them?

Why am I suddenly responsible for someone else's attitudes and reactions and hangups?

The cross bothers me because it is a symbol of those responsible for the persecution and bloody murder of my ancestors (as well as various other crimes through history). This is no different than the above, but you don't see me walking around telling the Christians they should not wear their crosses in public or in my presence. Should I?

I've said before, and it bears repeating here, "Sometimes, being offended has nothing to do with being offensive."

Thus I can only conclude as follows, regarding your example and similar: This is the Germans' problem, not the Bhuddists'. Otherwise, you argue for a confusion of my responsibility to others with your own desires and reactions.

Exact same thing here when we're talking dressing up like drow elves and blackface. I am sorry blackface offends you and has been used to hurt POC in the past, but blackface has nothing to do with dressing up like drow elves. The context is important.

(Or are we saying that guy we both know shouldn't have used that one phrase because of the furor and backlash it caused, and that furor wasn't actually those people's problem, but the guy's?)

(Reply to this) (Parent)

	delux_vivens 2006-08-16 07:13 pm UTC (link)
	At this point, i'm cant get trmendously upset-- not becuase its not upsetting, but because I dont expect anything better from fandom geeks at this point... (Reply to this) (Thread)

	yeloson 2006-08-16 07:22 pm UTC (link)
	Actually, I'm more upset at the number of people who are vigorously defending it. (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

gigolohitman
2006-08-18 12:30 pm UTC (link)

Don't be upset at people defending something. Noone has just said "It's cool, whatever" - they've all thought about their answers. Be happy they are engaging.

I was firmly in the "it's makeup" school when I started reading this. Presumably at some point in the future it will be okay for anyone to wear makeup of any colour, right?

But reading what's been written, and looking at that link, I reckon if, RIGHT NOW, people are using this stuff such that it remains a symbol of racist attitudes then I can see why there is good reason not to use it.

But then (!) are you saying that I can paint my face any colour, to resemble anything, as long as I don't resemble a black man? Because that right there seems inherantly wrong to me.

So now I'm on the fence. It seems crazy to me to suggest that dressing as a drow is significantly offensive. It seems that anyone at a games convention likely says "that's a drow", rather than feeling oppressed by the makeup. But symbols are really powerful, and if a black face is truely symbolic of oppression and mockery, then people shouldn't just wear them.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

yeloson
2006-08-18 03:34 pm UTC (link)

I'm against color-face used to represent any other human race period. But, I am saying there is a large enough history of blackface used to mock and harm that people should know better.

I've explained to someone else, but consider- if you're a Buddhist visiting Germany and you wear a Swastika (originally a Buddhist symbol), the German people will tell you to remove it. Not because you have negative intent, but because it's historically loaded and hurtful.

Also- the Drow people didn't just stay in the convention- they also walked in blackface -outside-, on the streets, into restaurants. Take your random passerby without D&D knowledge, what are they to assume if they're driving by or not looking too closely?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

	gigolohitman 2006-08-19 08:01 pm UTC (link)
	I'll strongly disagree about the any-colour thing. But that's a different thing. If as you say it has become a symbol of mockery and harm then there are two legitimate choices, whatever the symbol is - You can win the symbol back somehow, or you can make it taboo. Wearing it casually, uncaring of it's now-ingrained meaning isn't a moral option, I agree. (Reply to this) (Parent)

yeloson
2006-08-18 03:35 pm UTC (link)

Don't be upset at people defending something. Noone has just said "It's cool, whatever" - they've all thought about their answers. Be happy they are engaging

Actually, a couple of people in other discussions elsewhere have defended it along these lines, "How DARE you get upset about this?!? It's my unalienable right to dress up in blackface if I want to!"

Which is not very well thought out, and what they're defending is their privilege, not their hobby.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

	gigolohitman 2006-08-19 07:58 pm UTC (link)
	Oh yeah - then slap them. I only had the context of this journal right here, and it seems pretty constructive. (Reply to this) (Parent)

dumnbunny
2006-08-18 04:04 pm UTC (link)

Ummm ... wow. That set of three pictures you linked to, especially the last one, number 19, showing the white angel triumphantly standing with her foot on her fallen black foe, are deeply disturbing. Pic 19 instantly reminded me of what I believe was an advert for the movie Birth of a Nation. If it wasn't that, it was some other KKK propaganda. It showed a klansman in an identical pose.

Wow. I don't honestly believe the people doing this mean any harm (or perhaps as cynical as I try to be at times, I'm just too naive), but unintentional harm is still harm, and the people doing this need to be much less ignorant.

Yeloson, you're spot on with the swastika comparison. It's a very holy symbol to me, but I wouldn't dream of displaying it publicly. It is far too emotionally loaded a symbol, seeing it would hurt people, and I have no desire to hurt people. How many buddhist homes in the west publicly display this symbol? How many buddhists in an office display this symbol in their cubicle? Almost none.

If they can keep a deeply holy symbol of their religion hidden because of the hurt it would cause, fanboys of a fictional character should be able to ditch the black-face.

(Reply to this)

nakor
2006-08-19 03:49 am UTC (link)

Some Warhammer 40K costumes are easily mistakable for Nazi regalia. They often have cyberchainsaw boomguns involved too, but there's the red-on-black, simple fascist lines, and lots of skulls. The corresponding fantastical nation represents the real-world Nazi regime too: it's not the "good guys" by a long-shot, but it is in a world where its fascism is presented as necessary to win against the Orks, Eldar (elves), Chaos Demons, etc. So they're not obvious bad guys, and many people cosplay with that setting.

(Reply to this)

(Deleted post)

	yeloson 2006-08-26 01:35 am UTC (link)
	But we can't reach that point as long as we live in deliberate ignorance. Recurring cases of people in blackface have been appearing- so there's no way to "reappropriate" the concept given it's current state. In fact, it's impossible to reappropriate it ignorant of the hate that it is used for at the moment. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	delux_vivens 2006-08-27 02:58 am UTC (link)
	I'd love to see black folks turning the wearing of make-up to represent another race into a practice that brings about better understanding between races. boggle Because black folks need to fix other people's ignorance and racism why? (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(Deleted post)

	delux_vivens 2006-08-27 04:25 pm UTC (link)
	I think I want you to read this post, and maybe think about whether or not you need to go to some community like debunkingwhite. Because comparing drag kings, drag queens, and blackface is not working. (Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(Deleted post)

	delux_vivens 2006-08-28 04:35 am UTC (link)
	I didn't realize that only people of color were allowed to offer their perspectives on racism here. Not at all what that post said, but yes, perhaps you should unsubscribe. (Reply to this) (Parent)

	karnythia 2006-08-28 04:40 am UTC (link)
	This is so ridiculous as to be almost unbelievable. I could do a whole long post about the flaws in your argument, but I'm going to make it simple and point out that it is not remotely the responsibilty of the victims of racism to educate the racists they encounter. (Reply to this) (Parent)

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