WolvenOne ([info]wolvenone) wrote in [info]confurvatives,
@ 2008-05-02 15:19:00
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Interesting
Not particularly political, but I've recently followed up on some of the, technological aspects of Bio-Fuel production, and discovered some information on the subject that is quite revealing.

The word's top producer of Ethanol now is the United States, but its industry is inflated by government subsidization and the sheer immensity of the land the continent has available for agricultural uses. The second largest Ethanol producer in the world, is Brazil, which has been using Ethanol fuel since the 1990's, because leftovers from its sugarcane crops would have otherwise gone to waste, and because sugar based products convert to ethanol extremely well. America does not import much of it's ethanol from Brazil, as it currently imposes a fifty two cent import on every gallon of Ethanol imported, basically a big enough import to counter the subsidy on the Ethanol.

Where as Brazil uses sugar crops to create it's Ethanol, America has been using corn, not because it converts well, but rather because until recently it's been a fairly inexpensive readily available grain. However, corn must first be converted into sugar before it can be converted into Ethanol, making it an inefficient and expensive process. Factors such as these are largely going to doom the corn based ethanol industry, but there is a very compelling alternative which could potentially displace corn use for a much smaller cost, Sugar Beet Ethanol.

Sugar Beet's are hardy and can grow in nearly any environment with an actual summer, making them a more versatile crop than sugar cane. They convert into ethanol very easily, for a fraction of the price, and in places such as California they can even be grown in the winter. The downside is that this crop isn't yet grown on the scale it would need to be to displace corn. Scaling sugar beet production up however, is very conceivable, given the versatility of the crop.

Of course, this isn't a magic bullet solution, just because this would be more efficient doesn't mean we'll magically be able to quickly scale this up to meet the artificial ethanol needs imposed on America. However, as with Cellulistic Ethanol and scaling down ethanol mandates, this could be a component of the solution.

On an additional note. Corn is a very nutritionally intensive crop that makes it very difficult to grow. If you grow corn in a field, the next year you won't be able to use the same field to grow corn again because too many nutrients will have been stripped from the soil for more corn to grow. Sugar beets should not have this problem, so with reasonable fertilization, the same fields should be able to produce the same amount of sugar beets year after year. It would seem to me that this simple fact should make sugar beets far more sustainable for Ethanol production than Corn would be.


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[info]aerosblkjag
2008-05-03 12:21 am UTC (link)
I've wondered why this isn't pushed more myself.

Now, if bioengineers could splice in the legume gene that attracts rhizobia bacteria that fixates nitrogen without depleting the sucrose content of the root, we would have a winner.

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[info]wolvenone
2008-05-03 01:25 am UTC (link)
well, it appears as if some ethanol production in the USA is done using Sugar Beets, just not nearly as much as Corn, probably due to the fact that corn is a more common crop.

But you're right, it makes a whole lot more sense than using corn, and with a little genetic engineering it'd probably even be more ideal.

Now, if this and the Bacterial Ethanol production that Illinois company panned out, then I think you'd really have something. You could use waste products to get most of America's ethanol needs met, and Sugar Beet ethanol to even out our production a little. Any unused sugar beets could be converted to table sugar and molasseses and sold instead of going to waste.

Of course even if you did this on a really massive scale, you'd still need fossil fuels. Still, it would go a long way towards moving America towards energy independence, especially after we have 200mpg Plug-in hybrids or whatnot.

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[info]spikedpunch
2008-05-03 03:30 am UTC (link)
Corn is used because there are a lot of corn growers that vote.


I would like to hear more about the bio-fuels they are trying to make from left over animal products, like the stuff they refuse to put into hot dogs.

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[info]wolvenone
2008-05-03 05:03 am UTC (link)
considering that it's private companies producing the ethanol, I rather doubt it's because there are a lot of farmers that vote. Plus Sugar Beets make more sense for farmers as well. Corn has to be rotated out because it's so hard on the soil, sugar beets don't have the same limitation.

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[info]orig_rune
2008-05-03 07:24 am UTC (link)

The farmers ARE the reason. That's why the law got passed. They now get a far better price for corn and they like that. They won't experiment with other crops unless forced to. The immediate rewards won't be enough incentive.

Laws are always about (perceived) votes. For or against. Usually the former. That this also pleased ADM and others was a bonus but they'd have never pushed through a bill that benefited one company/industry so openly like that. Voters would rebel and punish them. They have made that mistake in the past. So they got the farmers on board. (Unlike NAIS.)

But with thousands of farmers, small distillers, agri-business, and environmentalists happy they have locked in a system to get repeated votes. Anyone who wants to repeal it will risk destruction by those groups. Think the Sugar Lobby. 1800 jobs have driven tens of thousands out of business. (I won't even go into the laws that FORBID growing some things, like oranges.)

This is why government can do terribly destructive things and stay in power. In other countries, ahead of us on the march to socialism, they have gutted society and business. Taking everything from "The Rich" may anger a few thousands but it pleases millions and too many voters are selfish and spiteful. Even though it's been proven to be bad they still want to do it.

(Both Hillary and Obama say they will increase taxes even though it will result in a DECLINE of revenue. They want to visibly HURT one class to please another.)

The founders had the right idea: only people with a stake in society/the economy should vote. Once that was removed it became a game of voting to get goodies paid for by someone else. The original voters were disenfranchised and made into slaves of the non-productive.

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[info]wolvenone
2008-05-03 08:09 am UTC (link)
While I agree with a lot of what you are saying, the sugar industry also wants into the ethanol business, *Thus the 52cent tariff on importing ethanol from Brazil." The logic is that if fuel companies can just buy cheap sugar ethanol from Brazil, the American sugar-ethanol industry won't ever get off it's feet.

So there's more than one, constituency involved here.

As for the notion that farmers won't switch crops until they absolutely have to. Well, they absolutely have to. Corn depletes nutrients from the soil so quickly that it cannot be grown on the same land two years in a row. We just don't have enough land to grow enough corn to meet the mandates, let alone meet the mandates each and every year.

The companies buying and selling the fuel know this, and have lost any economic benefit it might have had, so they're going to be scrambling to find alternative sources and alternative crops.

On your over arching point, you're right, and I agree that we've got too many people voting who have no business doing so. Unfortunately I don't really see any way to fix the problem, sadly.

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[info]wolvenone
2008-05-03 08:40 am UTC (link)
Side note: The only notion, ONLY notion, I've ever had, that might correct the problem but could be sold, is the idea of requiring people to participate in lower elections before voting in a federal one.

So basically, if you want to be able to vote for President, you'll have to vote for state governor, state senator, or so on.

That would at least weed out the lazy, which goes a long way towards correcting the problem right there.

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[info]aerosblkjag
2008-05-03 11:39 pm UTC (link)
I'm kind of partial to Heinlein's solution in Starship Troopers (book, not movie): Suffrage is granted only after completion of two years of voluntary military service.

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[info]wolvenone
2008-05-04 03:23 am UTC (link)
That'd work too, but I think it'd be impossible to sell it. Requiring people to vote in state or local elections first would be sellable, because it's really not all that big of a deal. It mainly just requires people not to be lazy and to pay attention to local politics first.

Overall voting would go down, but nobody could accuse this of singling out any group of people. Laziness is universal, it effects all ethnic groups equally.

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