Thu, Jul. 10th, 2008, 04:47 pm
shamed411 : A Fetish of a Different Color: "Blackmail" vs. "Greymail"
As a still-fascinated, yet recovering, addict from this particular fetish, I am feel in a unique position to write knowledgeably and objectively about what is known here as "Consensual Blackmail." I feel compelled to put fingers to keyboard at this time because of what I am seeing as an increasingly perilous trend within the blackmail fetish.
First, let me say that what I am about to say is about a group of SPECIFIC people, and NOT a broad generalization about a generation.
I hope I am not insulting anyone when I say that one gains experience with age. I’m not saying that a Baby Boomer such as myself is AUTOMATICALLY smarter than someone younger, BUT let’s just say that the 55-year-old Shamed would kick the ass of the 20-year-old Shamed in anything but purely physical combat.
You don’t always get “smarter,” as you age, but you do ALWAYS become less ignorant. Yeah, you can try to shoot arrows at this paragraph, but read on.
My observation both from personal experience and from what I hear, is that more and more, and younger and younger, women are entering the financial fetish arena. And are doing so with guns blazing, jumping from literally NO experience right to becoming full-fledged practitioners of the Blackmail fetish.
This attitude is what I call “the Nintendo Syndrome.” Louder and bolder and more in-your-face and brassier. There is no ramping up, no “second gear,” or “medium,” or “subtle,” or (gasp) learning. Just dive off the diving board and if you see there is no water in the pool, simply press the “Start Over” button. You never die, you just lose one of your lives, and you can always get more. You get saved, all harm is reversed, and you play the game again. It is how this generation approaches their relationships, their careers, and their finances. And it is also evident in how many of these women approach this fetish.
(As a quick aside, pissing on the Boomers won’t change this, Gen-X and the MTV Generation, etc. We Boomers have fucked up ZILLIONS of things up in our society, BUT this particular fuck up falls right on you folks.)
I am seeing more and more young women (and yes, I will assume they ARE “young” and “women.” This is how they identify themselves) jumping in with threats and “Or Else” demands. Personally, I think they look silly. Simply screaming demands on an open board without any “cred” or track record or subtlety or experience or foundation to back you up makes you look like Bozo the Domme.
Many – most? – of these women don’t last. They come on, post a few posts and vanish when they don’t succeed. Others vanish BUT then LEARN from their mistakes and STUDY, then come back as a new screenname. Of these, some repeat the same old mistakes and some actually reinvent themselves as someone quite impressive and successful.
But during the “15 Minutes” of fame that the first group may have (We are a culture that LOVES “shiny and new”), they often do something that is incredibly damaging not only to the Money Masochists they happen to ensnare, but also to the fetish and potentially to themselves (but that is another story).
To distinguish between consensual and non-consensual blackmail, I am going to toss a new term into this fetish today, and that is “Greymail.” Yes, it exists in other contexts, arts and industries, but in this fetish, I will start using the term Greymail to distinguish that which WE do here – Consensual Blackmail Fetish -- from that which has existed for centuries, which is serious, real, damaging and illegal and non consensual, and I will call “Blackmail.”
With Greymail, there are “rules.” There may be the “illusion” of chaos and anarchy in the potential damage that can be done, but 99% of the women practicing this, as I have noted, are responsible and smart and very adept at creating the illusion of potentially real, permanent damage and life destruction. This is not to say that REAL damage can’t happen in Greymail “play.” Things can escalate. They can backfire. Mistakes happen. Exposure happens. Anger happens. . . shit happens. But the difference is that in SANE (vs. Insane) Greymail, the intent is not pure extortion and probable exposure.
In REAL Blackmail, there is certainly no eroticism (except for the terminally self-destructive on BOTH ends who get off on causing lifequakes), and the goal is pure and simple extortion.
The result of Blackmail gone wrong is destruction. The result of Greymail gone wrong is, in virtually all cases, either the illusion of destruction, disturbance, exposure, OR very low or low-level instances of these things. Think of the difference between a poison steak and a tainted hors d’oeuvre. One kills you; the other usually only gives you the runs.
What to do?
Well, the first thing one needs to do on here is realize that in the Age of the Internet, there IS no absolute “privacy.” Anyone who knows a half-dozen select websites and wants to plunk down $19.99 for deeper information, CAN and WILL find out who you are. NO one – yes, NO one – is beyond having their real information cracked by someone persistent enough to dig and filter until the dam bursts.
And while there is danger for anyone who “plays” at anything kinky or extramarital, there is no riskier arena than thinking you are involved in Greymail, but having it turn into its darker cousin, Blackmail.
I am throwing these three questions open to the group:
1. What do YOU recommend as methods for keeping your personal information private?
2. What steps can you take in guarding against falling into a relationship that can turn from Greymail to Blackmail?
3. Can you distinguish between the two? If you are a submissive, can you tell if someone is into consensual Greymail or non-consensual Blackmail? Do you know how to ride the borderline without going over it? As a dominant, can you really distinguish which one you are practicing?
Thu, Jul. 10th, 2008 09:40 pm (UTC)
Damn I was hoping to see oodles and oodles of comments from various Princess' Dommes and Fetishists.....but I see none at the moment. I try to stay away from the blackmail aspect for a few simple reasons-lawsuit and invasion of My privacy. For Me it is one thing to have someone via niteflirt say "Princess I beg you to blackmail me", then giving up info so easily I wonder hmmm is this really REAL information. Sometimes yes it is and sometimes this person is so lonely with no family that they don't feel the suffering if there was a 'real' family or wife finding out that he blows thousands of dollars on Princess Michelle. I prefer your term GRAYMAIL, not because I am less Domme than others but because I have a lot of valuable items as well as money from My line of internet domination and to lose it all over a picture of some guy wearing pink panties is not how I'm going to be taken down. Some may say I'm wrong or scared NOPE just very smart because not everyone is who they say they are online and off line. FinDommes are receiving more and more negativity due to so many new youtube bloggers and fake profiles. It may be easy to acquire one's info but if and WHEN it bites you in the ass I doubt that it will be as easy when you're being audited by the IRS or tossed in jail. So GRAYMAIL is a wonderful name and I enjoyed reading your post.Edited at 2008-07-10 09:42 pm (UTC)
Fri, Aug. 29th, 2008 11:46 pm (UTC)
malice : My Thoughts About Blackmail Fetishes...
I think one of the main problems with blackmail fetish is that many of the Dominants offering blackmail exploration are all too willing to accept any boy with a pulse and a wallet. Personally to enter into a blackmail agreement with Myself a boy must first complete five steps to even be considered for blackmail training. I find that the strict system I have developed rules out many of the boys who only love blackmail when their little cocks are hard and My system also gives the more serious blackmail submissives a chance to truly think about their decision to enter into such an agreement with Myself before doing so.
Sat, Aug. 30th, 2008 03:50 am (UTC)
shamed411 : Care to share . . .
Greetings again, Malice.
Personally to enter into a blackmail agreement with Myself a boy must first complete five steps to even be considered for blackmail training. I find that the strict system I have developed rules out many of the boys who only love blackmail when their little cocks are hard and My system also gives the more serious blackmail submissives a chance to truly think about their decision to enter into such an agreement with Myself before doing so.
Do you care to share what is behind the Five Steps? And how does it allow the submissive to think about their decision?
Thu, Apr. 15th, 2010 11:46 pm (UTC)
owndnow : what if it is not exactly Consensual
I was playing with a Domme a few years ago buying her tributes etc. I broke things off and have since gotten married but she found out where I live my wife's name etc and has shown back up and just started blackmailing me to "spoil" her again. This was not my fetish but I have to admit it is pretty exciting. However I am worried about where this might lead and what it could do to my marriage. Anyone have any advice?
Sat, Apr. 17th, 2010 11:53 pm (UTC)
shamed411 : Re: what if it is not exactly Consensual
Hi. While I am not in this life anymore, I saw your post here.
I guess my view is that if you start "responding" erotically to a blackmail scenario, you are screwed. You have eroticized it, and many financial dommes can smell that, and they will try to find your personal weakness and get then keep you hooked.
You need to keep any "Commitment" to this erotic extortionist to a minimum. It can be very damaging, and if you are someone who responds to it, addicting.
Sun, Apr. 18th, 2010 02:22 pm (UTC)
owndnow : Re: what if it is not exactly Consensual
Thanks for the comment shamed. I am really surprised that I could be tempted by this. Like I said it was never something I fantasized about and wasting money, debt etc. goes against everything I believe in. But when I think about her threatening to tell my wife if I don't send her a tribute I do get a rush. And also there is the threat. like I said the blackmail was not agreed on ahead of time. This is something she is doing to regain control over me and there is the possibility that she will carry through with her threats. So I have to figure out how to get out of it without getting burned.
Tue, Apr. 20th, 2010 02:21 pm (UTC)
shamed411 : Re: what if it is not exactly Consensual
Well, the "fact" of the matter is that non-consensual blackmail is . . . blackmail. It is a felony, and serious shit for her, but also for you, as you'd have to testify, and confess to your wife/family/employer what you got yourself into.
If it is "consensual" (such a paradox, isn't it? Kind of like "I am going to commit suicide, but I want YOU to pull the trigger."), there MIGHT be mitigating circumstances in court for her. "It was fantasy play," "It's a relatively common kink, of COURSE I wasn't going to REALLY hurt him!" etc. If she is living on the margin financially and socially, she may think that she can double-down on this and that it is worth the risk. "Fuck it," she might say, and go for the whole pot.
So it becomes a game of "brinksmanship." How far WILL she really go if you say "No" to her extortion demands.
And if THAT is the erotic knife edge you are playing on, she will SMELL it, and edge you closer to her financial advantage. If she is smart, she would think long term and extort manageable bits while she stokes and strokes you just enough to keep you in both fear AND lust so you do NOT put the brakes on. (Oh, and she would also gather enough further information on you to make it even harder for you to "Just say No!")
If YOU can financially and emotionally handle that kind of symbiotic "partnership," you could ACTUALLY have a win-win situation where you each get what you want/need. (Yes Virginia, the right "balance" MAY be possible for some folks in this. I found out there WAS no "right balance" for me, and got out. I'm happier for that.)
But if you truly don't want ANY part of this, you need to totally turn off the spigot. As long as you are still lusting for this type of dynamic, and she (and others) sense that the "high" is more important to you than the risk from their blackmail efforts, the $harks will smell the blood and go in for the kill.
Sun, Jun. 20th, 2010 08:28 am (UTC)
(Anonymous): Re: what if it is not exactly Consensual
I'm just curious. I was in a consensual blackmail relationship with a Domme. It was open ended, which was stupid. But that's what I agreed to. I paid tens of thousands of dollars over several years, but I got a lot of pleasure out of it. I tried to negotiate a cease fire, but with no success. My information was revealed to coworkers. I ended up quitting my job because I couldn't face anyone at work. The info was pretty bad, and personal to those that received it. I ended up having to reinvent myself, new career, etc. I say this because, I don't know what you mean exactly by graymail. What I did may not have been rational, and what she did may not have been rational either, but it's what I agreed to... so I see it as what I deserved. I was very angry at first, and sent some threatening emails, but once things settled down, I apologized and admitted my wrong.
Would you consider what happened to me graymail or blackmail?
Sun, Jun. 20th, 2010 09:04 pm (UTC)
shamed411 : Re: what if it is not exactly Consensual
Well, the result itself defined it as "blackmail." Greymail -- as I had defined it -- would not have resulted in as devastating result.
But as I noted, even "Greymail" can turn dark. Mistakes can happen. Things can escalate.
Yes, "open ended" was not a smart thing.
But you have generated more questions that need clarifying:
1. Why did you want "out," and what did you offer as "negotiation" from your side? A buyout? etc?
2. Was this Domme someone who has/had a reputation in the scene? Or a newbie?
3. After a number of years, you should have had a "relationship," I am guessing, that should have put you in a position to discuss this.
My guess is you did NOT handle this "bowing out," gracefully or wisely. When you hand someone that amount of power, and you (and probably she) got off on this exchange and situation, perhaps you made some personal errors or miscalculations in this.
Can you think of any way you could have handled this better?
Fri, Jul. 23rd, 2010 04:11 pm (UTC)
subtacular1 : blackmail
I think I am very similar to you, in the process of trying to recover from a blackmail addiction. I still love the fetish and am having a difficult time walking away from it, but I know its in my own interests to do so. I have literally spent in excess of 40 thousand (yes thousand) dollars on this fetish to several Mistresses over the past two years that I can no longer support the habit. In a way its a blessing because I know if I had alot of money left I would continue with the addiction (and it is an addiction). I would continue even though I have a wife ythat has been hurt by all of this spending and it has damaged our relationship. Over time I had given up all information I could to my Mistresses to try to regain the rush of the fetish, not only addresses and phone numbers, but online accounts and passwords, facebook passwords, anything I had I would give up. The more I gave up the better I felt. When I finally stopped with some Mistresses nothing happened, I just didn't hear from them again. Other Mistresses posted compromising info and pics online, and one Mistress actually did call my house and leave a message. I would agree with your point that if you have given up alot of info to a Mistress, it is important that when you want to end it you do it carefully. We may think we know who is on the other end of our computers but when push comes to shove you could be in alot of trouble. Be careful with this fetish. It is highly enjoyable at first and when you have money, but when you run dry it is no fun. I have to admit when i get a little money I still send 100 here and 100 ther on occasion, but I am determined not to be run broke again.